[GRLUG] OFF TOPIC Electric Car

[Rick Vargo]

Ben DeMott wrote:
> What no-one tells you about renewable energy is that soon the golden
> days will be over...
> All energy ultimately comes from the SUN, we had a built up capacity
> of energy from however long oil was forming in the earth before we
> started pumping it out.
> Same thing with Coal.
> Once all of the expendable resources are used up, we will never reach
> a level of efficiency that we had before.
> We will HAVE to put in more work to get less nomatter what... unless
> we somehow blanket the earth in solar cells, and sterling engines, or
> drill a giant hole deep into the earth (another unlimited resource)
There is also nuclear fusion (first plant already being built in France
which should be viable in 20 years), and they are working on other
alternatives like zero point energy (50-100 years)
>
> The problem with all alternative energies are a couple things ...
> 1.) Gasoline is the most dense form of energy available pretty much ...
Alcohol was used long before gasoline and is just as efficient in a
motor tuned for alcohol. Actually gasoline was originally a waste
product from the processing of oil for lubricants, etc.
> 2.) Most energy carriers are less efficient than gasoline (gasoline as
> been forming in the bowls of the earth for ... well awhile)
Yes and no. There are some that are more efficient (like nuclear) and
some less (like solar)
> 3.) Of the other forms of energy carriers, transfer is less efficient
> than gasoline - you have to use a High-Energy to yield another
> High-Energy (coal, to chemical electrical) and the efficiency loss is
> *pretty* high.
I am not understanding what you are saying here? You burn coal to get
fire just like you burn gasoline.
> 4.) What is the actual source of the energy ?
>
> Eventually everything will have to be Wind, Water, Solar, or
> Geo-Electric ...
> And at that point a Hydrogen economy makes the most sense - you can
> pack hydrogen into solid forms and keep it almost as dense as it would
> be at a liquid state - and hey cryogenic cooling in the summer time
> eliminates the need for an A/C Compressor and Coolant :)
Free hydrogen is very hard to find on this planet. You have to break it
from other atoms like oxygen which requires energy.
>
> It's unlikely Capacitors, or Batteries will ever become efficient
> storage mediums for energy - chemicals wear out, and the energy loss
> during transfer is quite great, but hey Obama wants to build 12 new
> Nuclear Power Plants - we'll be in good shape haha
You are thinking of current capacitors and batteries in use for
electronics. New ones on the horizon are much efficient.
>
> On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 2:58 PM, <Bill_Raterink at spartanstores.com
> <mailto:Bill_Raterink at spartanstores.com>> wrote:
>
>
>     I had seen a documentary that said switch grass was the most
>     efficient biofuel.
>
>
>
>     From: 	
>     Rick Vargo <rick at vargo.org <mailto:rick at vargo.org>>
>     To: 	grlug at grlug.org <mailto:grlug at grlug.org>
>     Date: 	11/19/2008 02:51 PM
>     Subject: 	Re: [GRLUG] OFF TOPIC Electric Car
>
>
>     ------------------------------------------------------------------------
>
>
>
>     Corn is a terrible bio fuel you can only get about 700 gallons from an
>     acre. Sugar cane is the best. Around here, the best thing to grow
>     for a
>     bio fuel is probably sugar beats. I think an acre will make about 1700
>     gallons of alcohol.
>
>     Rick
>
>
>     Michael Mol wrote:
>     > On Wed, Nov 19, 2008 at 2:29 PM, Collin Kidder <adderd at kkmfg.com
>     <mailto:adderd at kkmfg.com>> wrote:
>     >  
>     >> An electric motor can be made darn near 100% efficient. As a bonus
>     >> electrical lines are found almost everywhere. It's like a built
>     in gas
>     >> station in every building you see. So, I do believe that
>     electric cars
>     >> will end up being the way forward.
>     >>    
>     >
>     > It remains to be seen how efficiently synthetic hydrocarbon
>     fuels can
>     > be made; If those can be made sufficiently efficient, powering cars
>     > off the grid won't work.
>     >
>     > Granted, corn doesn't appear to be getting us off to a good start.
>     >  
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