Just curious, is the fast to get license<div>a novice license, or a general license?</div><div>i.e., the one day marathon license.</div><div><br></div><div>I gather there are no use requirements </div><div>for keeping a license active. </div>
<div><br></div><div>Anyway, no encryption would kill the idea.</div><div>Any idea what the reason is?</div><div><br></div><div>A more testy question, what is the primary</div><div>motivation for becoming a ham today? In</div>
<div>days gone by, one learned a lot about radio</div><div>and electronics, because many people built</div><div>their own equipment. But that hasn't been</div><div>the case for decades, as good Japanese </div><div>radios became available for good prices.</div>
<div><br></div><div>Without that learning incentive, what is</div><div>the reason people become hams today?</div><div><br></div><div>Or is my assumption wrong?</div><div><br></div><div> -- Bob</div><div><br></div><div><br>
<div class="gmail_quote">On Wed, Dec 22, 2010 at 8:15 AM, Matt Michielsen <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mattmichielsen@gmail.com">mattmichielsen@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex;">
The biggest issue with the ham license is that you aren't allowed to use encryption. I'm KD8EVV but haven't had a radio turned on in years.<br><br><div class="gmail_quote"><div><div></div><div class="h5">On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 5:52 PM, Bob Kline <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:bob.kline@gmail.com" target="_blank">bob.kline@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
</div></div><blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex"><div><div></div><div class="h5">And there's a lot one can do with antennas.<div>c.g. Cyberguys, or Amazon. </div>
<div><br></div><div><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.11n" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.11n</a></div>
<div><br></div><div><a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/802.11n" target="_blank"></a>Outdoor ranges of over 800 feet, with</div><div>much more to come.</div><div><br></div><font color="#888888"><div> -- Bob</div></font><div>
<div></div><div><div><br><br><div class="gmail_quote">On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 5:46 PM, Michael Mol <span dir="ltr"><<a href="mailto:mikemol@gmail.com" target="_blank">mikemol@gmail.com</a>></span> wrote:<br>
<blockquote class="gmail_quote" style="margin:0 0 0 .8ex;border-left:1px #ccc solid;padding-left:1ex">I'm looking more toward 802.11abgn techs for layer 2. The hardware's<br>
cheaper and better developed.<br>
<div><div></div><div><br>
On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 5:11 PM, Bob Kline <<a href="mailto:bob.kline@gmail.com" target="_blank">bob.kline@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
> 200 licensed hams. Become a ham in a day:<br>
> <a href="http://www.migunowners.org/forum/archive/index.php/t-38711.html" target="_blank">http://www.migunowners.org/forum/archive/index.php/t-38711.html</a><br>
> and<br>
> <a href="http://www.w8dc.org/" target="_blank">http://www.w8dc.org/</a><br>
> Ham nets have long used AX.25, an old<br>
> telephone company error handling approach:<br>
> <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FX.25_Forward_Error_Correction" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FX.25_Forward_Error_Correction</a><br>
> and have been sending data around for<br>
> at least 20 years. Today that could be<br>
> Internet protocols.<br>
> I guess the real issue is performance and<br>
> cost. I predict that Comcast will start charging<br>
> more for what we're already getting. So, in a<br>
> band for the buck way, could a ham-like wireless<br>
> approach make sense. And does it exist now.<br>
> It looks to me like one needs a ham license<br>
> first, after which systems exist. Just a guess.<br>
> Being amateur, I take it a for profit ISP could<br>
> not spring up and offer access, or a hardware-software<br>
> package to enable a user. But for starters, the<br>
> GRARA does have towers.<br>
> - -Bob<br>
><br>
><br>
> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 4:51 PM, Michael Mol <<a href="mailto:mikemol@gmail.com" target="_blank">mikemol@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>><br>
>> I've got a callsign...KD8KLW.<br>
>><br>
>> I'm not unfamiliar with those, but I wasn't sure their model reflected<br>
>> what I was interested in trying.<br>
>><br>
>> From what I've learned about IPv6, a meshy backbone seems very doable.<br>
>> It's even plausible that it could get public IPv6 addresses allocated<br>
>> to it, if it were likely to have enough users to successfully justify<br>
>> the allocation. (I think the going requirement is 'must have at least<br>
>> 200 users', but I'm not sure.)<br>
>><br>
>> On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 4:36 PM, Bob Kline <<a href="mailto:bob.kline@gmail.com" target="_blank">bob.kline@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>> > Another: <a href="http://www.echolink.org/" target="_blank">http://www.echolink.org/</a><br>
>> > You've got to have a ham license, but<br>
>> > I don't think that is too big a hurdle.<br>
>> > Otherwise, such networks seem to be<br>
>> > well oiled operations today.<br>
>> > Alas, one snag might be Linux - some<br>
>> > of the operations seem to be windoz based.... :-(<br>
>> > -- Bob<br>
>> ><br>
>> > On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 4:28 PM, Michael Mol <<a href="mailto:mikemol@gmail.com" target="_blank">mikemol@gmail.com</a>> wrote:<br>
>> >><br>
>> >> I was the one bringing up the idea. I presented it in front of the LUG<br>
>> >> at Casey's place around then. I recall one person being interested in<br>
>> >> getting together to discuss it, but we never wound up making a<br>
>> >> connection. I've been reading up a *lot* on IPv6 and network management<br>
>> >> in general, and it might still be doable. I wouldn't be ready to leap<br>
>> >> on<br>
>> >> it soon, though; I smell a lot more knowledge about networking tools<br>
>> >> that I need to read through before I can really figure it out.<br>
>> >><br>
>> >> One of the key problems, though, is setting up one or two large towers.<br>
>> >> Mesh networking is useful, awesome and excellent, but there need to be<br>
>> >> a<br>
>> >> couple supernodes that represent a fast(er) travel route to another<br>
>> >> part<br>
>> >> of the network. A supernode like that Needs to have visibility to a<br>
>> >> large geographical area, which means (as a WAP) that it has needs to<br>
>> >> have the characteristics of a cell phone tower.<br>
>> >><br>
>> >> A couple friends of mine have been trying to figure out how to set up a<br>
>> >> simple three-node relay on the south-west side of town, but the<br>
>> >> physical<br>
>> >> geography of the region gets in the way. (And there's an airport just<br>
>> >> west of Wilson Ave. that limits the height of any towers placed in<br>
>> >> convenient places on that hill.)<br>
>> >><br>
>> >> On Tue, 2010-12-21 at 16:06 -0500, Bob Kline wrote:<br>
>> >> > There was actually talk about this<br>
>> >> > within the group - maybe a year ago.<br>
>> >> > Something like using radio relay.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > It might come to that.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LUSFiber" target="_blank">http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LUSFiber</a><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > Done by the city of Lafayette, LA, it is<br>
>> >> > perhaps the best Internet system on the<br>
>> >> > planet. Fiber to the home, full duplex<br>
>> >> > 50 Mbps service for $58 a month.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > Yes, Verizon and AT&T sued to block<br>
>> >> > its construction. But it was built, and<br>
>> >> > can service as model to any properly<br>
>> >> > managed city.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > Now lets see what Comcast does to us.<br>
>> >> > Especially if it acquires NBC.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > -- Bob<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 4:00 PM, Clay Ashby <<a href="mailto:kingpoiuy@gmail.com" target="_blank">kingpoiuy@gmail.com</a>><br>
>> >> > wrote:<br>
>> >> > We could start our own internet! :p<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > --Sent from my android.<br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > On Dec 21, 2010 2:13 PM, "Bob Kline" <<a href="mailto:bob.kline@gmail.com" target="_blank">bob.kline@gmail.com</a>><br>
>> >> > > wrote:<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > The FCC has spoken. On behalf of<br>
>> >> > > monopoly provider interests that is:<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> ><br>
>> >> > <a href="http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9201918/FCC_approves_compromise_Net_neutrality_rules?taxonomyId=70" target="_blank">http://www.computerworld.com/s/article/9201918/FCC_approves_compromise_Net_neutrality_rules?taxonomyId=70</a><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > **<br>
>> >> > > IDG News Service - The U.S. Federal Communications<br>
>> >> > > Commission (FCC), in a historic vote Tuesday, approved<br>
>> >> > > network neutrality rules prohibiting broadband providers<br>
>> >> > > from blocking customer access to legal Web content, but<br>
>> >> > many<br>
>> >> > > consumer groups decried the new regulations as weak and<br>
>> >> > full<br>
>> >> > > of loopholes.<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > The new rules provide fewer protections for mobile<br>
>> >> > broadband<br>
>> >> > > subscribers and may lead to a fractured Internet, critics<br>
>> >> > > said. The new rules, a compromise championed by FCC<br>
>> >> > Chairman<br>
>> >> > > Julius Genachowski, would bar wireline-based broadband<br>
>> >> > > providers -- but not mobile broadband providers -- from<br>
>> >> > > "unreasonable discrimination" against Web traffic,<br>
>> >> > prompting<br>
>> >> > > some consumer groups to call the rules "fake" net<br>
>> >> > > neutrality.<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > Genachowski's plan, approved after more than seven years of<br>
>> >> > > debate about whether net neutrality rules are needed, also<br>
>> >> > > contains several loopholes for broadband providers, critics<br>
>> >> > > said, including an exception for managed services separate<br>
>> >> > > from the public Internet.<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > **<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > Standard hack politics. Clearly monopoly<br>
>> >> > > corporate entities run the Internet now,<br>
>> >> > > and I suspect the rubes will be<br>
>> >> > > squeezed ever harder. Loopholes.<br>
>> >> > > Exceptions.<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > The day mostly official marks the end of<br>
>> >> > > one Internet. Everyone will now<br>
>> >> > > have to choose which Internet they<br>
>> >> > > want to be on, and have to figure<br>
>> >> > > out just what the monopoly players<br>
>> >> > > are likely to let through. Comcast must<br>
>> >> > > be licking its chops about now, as leader<br>
>> >> > > of the forces tinkering with content and<br>
>> >> > > uses. All hopefully without anyone noticing.<br>
>> >> > > Going forward, it appears it will have a largely<br>
>> >> > > free hand, not even try to hide its actions,<br>
>> >> > > and simply say it's all legal, and of course fair.<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > -- Bob<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > On Tue, Dec 21, 2010 at 2:04 PM, John-Thomas Richards<br>
>> >> > > <<a href="mailto:jtr@jrichards.org" target="_blank">jtr@jrichards.org</a>> wrote:<br>
>> >> > > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > > On Tue, Dec 21...<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > --<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > This message has been scanned for viruses and<br>
>> >> > > dangerous content by MailScanner, and is<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > believ...<br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > ><br>
>> >> > > _______________________________________________<br>
>> >> > > grlug mailing list<br>
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>> >> ><br>
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