From grlugcasey at gmail.com  Tue Jan  1 00:27:26 2013
From: grlugcasey at gmail.com (Casey DuBois)
Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2013 00:27:26 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Happy New Year!!!
Message-ID: <8AE75807-2DA6-4E0A-BE77-FF5EC077C84B@gmail.com>

Happy New Year!!!
See you Wednesday for the First GRLUG/GRMakers Social!!!

Regards,
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942

From rpusztai at gmail.com  Tue Jan  1 01:37:06 2013
From: rpusztai at gmail.com (Ryan Pusztai)
Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2013 01:37:06 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Happy New Year!!!
In-Reply-To: <8AE75807-2DA6-4E0A-BE77-FF5EC077C84B@gmail.com>
References: <8AE75807-2DA6-4E0A-BE77-FF5EC077C84B@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAKZE2hcc5E-7zx1xVh3N6PEuoy5QV6XK+p6U2vo44CXJMQZp0w@mail.gmail.com>

Happy new year!
--
Regards,
Ryan

Sent from my Droid
On Jan 1, 2013 12:27 AM, "Casey DuBois" <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:

> Happy New Year!!!
> See you Wednesday for the First GRLUG/GRMakers Social!!!
>
> Regards,
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
>
> --
>
>
>
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From slestak989 at gmail.com  Tue Jan  1 02:51:55 2013
From: slestak989 at gmail.com (Steve Romanow)
Date: Tue, 1 Jan 2013 02:51:55 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Happy New Year!!!
In-Reply-To: <CAKZE2hcc5E-7zx1xVh3N6PEuoy5QV6XK+p6U2vo44CXJMQZp0w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <8AE75807-2DA6-4E0A-BE77-FF5EC077C84B@gmail.com>
 <CAKZE2hcc5E-7zx1xVh3N6PEuoy5QV6XK+p6U2vo44CXJMQZp0w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAuMJGEqWERX5n77b0tNYv-NRCf6cXy1hDOS6J7fM1KQE58OUA@mail.gmail.com>

Likewise Fella's!


On Tue, Jan 1, 2013 at 1:37 AM, Ryan Pusztai <rpusztai at gmail.com> wrote:

> Happy new year!
> --
> Regards,
> Ryan
>
> Sent from my Droid
> On Jan 1, 2013 12:27 AM, "Casey DuBois" <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Happy New Year!!!
>> See you Wednesday for the First GRLUG/GRMakers Social!!!
>>
>> Regards,
>> Casey DuBois
>> 616-808-6942
>>
>> --
>>
>>
>>  --
>
>
>
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From john at wesorick.com  Wed Jan  2 15:54:19 2013
From: john at wesorick.com (John Wesorick)
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 15:54:19 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Ubuntu Mobile OS
Message-ID: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>

So Ubuntu announced their Mobile OS today. Not the Ubuntu for Android, but
a full OS. Here's a link to the video,
http://youtu.be/cpWHJDLsqTU?t=6m30sI had read that they will be
releasing images for Nexus devices in the
coming weeks. Anyone else thinks it's worth a try?
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From detrix42 at gmail.com  Wed Jan  2 16:34:25 2013
From: detrix42 at gmail.com (Jeret Lendman)
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2013 16:34:25 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the warehouse?
Message-ID: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>


Sent from my ASUS Pad

From kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com  Wed Jan  2 16:37:25 2013
From: kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com (Kelly Vanderwell)
Date: Wed, 02 Jan 2013 16:37:25 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the warehouse?
In-Reply-To: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>
References: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <50E4A895.8090809@gmail.com>

yes

On 01/02/2013 04:34 PM, Jeret Lendman wrote:
> Sent from my ASUS Pad
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug


From grlugcasey at gmail.com  Wed Jan  2 16:47:55 2013
From: grlugcasey at gmail.com (Casey DuBois)
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 16:47:55 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the warehouse?
In-Reply-To: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>
References: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>
Message-ID: <6C778EC6-A64A-4CBF-8ABB-54C57849A93F@gmail.com>

YES!!!!

Regards,
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942

On Jan 2, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Jeret Lendman <detrix42 at gmail.com> wrote:

> 
> Sent from my ASUS Pad
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From uhawl1 at gmail.com  Wed Jan  2 16:49:10 2013
From: uhawl1 at gmail.com (Joshua Yuhas)
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 16:49:10 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the warehouse?
In-Reply-To: <6C778EC6-A64A-4CBF-8ABB-54C57849A93F@gmail.com>
References: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>
 <6C778EC6-A64A-4CBF-8ABB-54C57849A93F@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALC3+TmoohgiGj=1GNyP9xG4my1SmJ_TKLT9UA+83LUhqJv+wA@mail.gmail.com>

YEEESSSSS!!!!
On Jan 2, 2013 4:48 PM, "Casey DuBois" <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:

> YES!!!!
>
> Regards,
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
>
> On Jan 2, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Jeret Lendman <detrix42 at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> >
> > Sent from my ASUS Pad
> > _______________________________________________
> > grlug mailing list
> > grlug at grlug.org
> > http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From f32cpe at hotmail.com  Wed Jan  2 18:37:04 2013
From: f32cpe at hotmail.com (mike langeweg)
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 18:37:04 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the
 warehouse?coming from 76th and eastern
In-Reply-To: <CALC3+TmoohgiGj=1GNyP9xG4my1SmJ_TKLT9UA+83LUhqJv+wA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <vl316j3t40nwtts8l0sdv8xd.1357162465045@email.android.com>,
 <6C778EC6-A64A-4CBF-8ABB-54C57849A93F@gmail.com>,
 <CALC3+TmoohgiGj=1GNyP9xG4my1SmJ_TKLT9UA+83LUhqJv+wA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <BLU171-W3421BBD2CD721789160163DE220@phx.gbl>


Someone wanted a ride from Kentwood and I am going tonight. I will be leaving around 7:30. you may call or text if you need a ride. (or anyone else from this direction.616-560-1126Mike

Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 16:49:10 -0500
From: uhawl1 at gmail.com
To: grlug at grlug.org
Subject: Re: [GRLUG] is there a grlug meeting tonight? At the warehouse?

YEEESSSSS!!!!
On Jan 2, 2013 4:48 PM, "Casey DuBois" <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:

YES!!!!



Regards,

Casey DuBois

616-808-6942



On Jan 2, 2013, at 4:34 PM, Jeret Lendman <detrix42 at gmail.com> wrote:



>

> Sent from my ASUS Pad

> _______________________________________________

> grlug mailing list

> grlug at grlug.org

> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

_______________________________________________

grlug mailing list

grlug at grlug.org

http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug



_______________________________________________
grlug mailing list
grlug at grlug.org
http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug 		 	   		  
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From jjesse at gmail.com  Wed Jan  2 21:53:34 2013
From: jjesse at gmail.com (Jonathan Jesse)
Date: Wed, 2 Jan 2013 21:53:34 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Ubuntu Mobile OS
In-Reply-To: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAEmRL8X8o+Oi=mV=PrqOQS+mBR8C4zfCdcn0nyUcsQbBsQ_pjg@mail.gmail.com>

Why?  This is the question I'm asking....  What will make this
device successful in the tight market that is already dominated by Android
and iOS with Blackberry and Windows Phone trailing in 3rd place.  I don't
think the "geeks" will rush out to adopt this phone as there seems to be
declining excitement in things Canonical/Ubuntu related.
There doesn't seem to be a committed carrier either which I think won't
drive adoption as well.  If they can't get VZW or AT&T selling/pushing this
phone then it will have even worse traction in the US than Windows Phone.

Or is it all an Europe/Asia thing?


On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM, John Wesorick <john at wesorick.com> wrote:

> So Ubuntu announced their Mobile OS today. Not the Ubuntu for Android, but
> a full OS. Here's a link to the video, http://youtu.be/cpWHJDLsqTU?t=6m30sI had read that they will be releasing images for Nexus devices in the
> coming weeks. Anyone else thinks it's worth a try?
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From john at wesorick.com  Thu Jan  3 10:03:03 2013
From: john at wesorick.com (John Wesorick)
Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 10:03:03 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Ubuntu Mobile OS
In-Reply-To: <CAEmRL8X8o+Oi=mV=PrqOQS+mBR8C4zfCdcn0nyUcsQbBsQ_pjg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEmRL8X8o+Oi=mV=PrqOQS+mBR8C4zfCdcn0nyUcsQbBsQ_pjg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACrkP+EbnP68=S3Kn_M4-S_QuOXZUPcNFwJRhzpSWkD5yzMvDQ@mail.gmail.com>

Freedom. Choice. Truly cross-device app design. It doesn't need to be
successful in an x% of marketshare way. We, as Linux users, got pretty
excited when we had 1-2% marketshare on the desktop. TBH, I'm more excited
about Ubuntu for Android, but I'm definitely going to try this out once
they release the image for my phone.


On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 9:53 PM, Jonathan Jesse <jjesse at gmail.com> wrote:

> Why?  This is the question I'm asking....  What will make this
> device successful in the tight market that is already dominated by Android
> and iOS with Blackberry and Windows Phone trailing in 3rd place.  I don't
> think the "geeks" will rush out to adopt this phone as there seems to be
> declining excitement in things Canonical/Ubuntu related.
> There doesn't seem to be a committed carrier either which I think won't
> drive adoption as well.  If they can't get VZW or AT&T selling/pushing this
> phone then it will have even worse traction in the US than Windows Phone.
>
> Or is it all an Europe/Asia thing?
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM, John Wesorick <john at wesorick.com> wrote:
>
>> So Ubuntu announced their Mobile OS today. Not the Ubuntu for Android,
>> but a full OS. Here's a link to the video,
>> http://youtu.be/cpWHJDLsqTU?t=6m30s I had read that they will be
>> releasing images for Nexus devices in the coming weeks. Anyone else thinks
>> it's worth a try?
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From dontwantspam1 at earthlink.net  Thu Jan  3 10:42:33 2013
From: dontwantspam1 at earthlink.net (Kyle)
Date: Thu, 03 Jan 2013 10:42:33 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Ubuntu Mobile OS
In-Reply-To: <CACrkP+EbnP68=S3Kn_M4-S_QuOXZUPcNFwJRhzpSWkD5yzMvDQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEmRL8X8o+Oi=mV=PrqOQS+mBR8C4zfCdcn0nyUcsQbBsQ_pjg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACrkP+EbnP68=S3Kn_M4-S_QuOXZUPcNFwJRhzpSWkD5yzMvDQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <50E5A6E9.4020504@earthlink.net>

Freedom and Choice are both largely true of Android, Open webOS, Firefox
OS, Meego, and Tizen.  Cross-platform app design is true of Open webOS,
Firefox OS, and Tizen, as well as probably others.  I don't mean to put
them down for contributing to more Freedom and Choice, but as much
market share as webOS lost, which for a while was well-supported by
carriers, had a large Palm fanbase behind it, and sold reasonably well,
Ubuntu Phone OS has a huge uphill battle ahead of them to develop a user
base capable of sustaining a project like that into the future.

My $0.02, for what it's worth.

- Kyle



On 01/03/2013 10:03 AM, John Wesorick wrote:
> Freedom. Choice. Truly cross-device app design. It doesn't need to be
> successful in an x% of marketshare way. We, as Linux users, got pretty
> excited when we had 1-2% marketshare on the desktop. TBH, I'm more
> excited about Ubuntu for Android, but I'm definitely going to try this
> out once they release the image for my phone. 
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 9:53 PM, Jonathan Jesse <jjesse at gmail.com
> <mailto:jjesse at gmail.com>> wrote:
>
>     Why?  This is the question I'm asking....  What will make this
>     device successful in the tight market that is already dominated by
>     Android and iOS with Blackberry and Windows Phone trailing in 3rd
>     place.  I don't think the "geeks" will rush out to adopt this
>     phone as there seems to be declining excitement in things
>     Canonical/Ubuntu related.
>     There doesn't seem to be a committed carrier either which I think
>     won't drive adoption as well.  If they can't get VZW or AT&T
>     selling/pushing this phone then it will have even worse traction
>     in the US than Windows Phone.
>
>     Or is it all an Europe/Asia thing? 
>
>
>     On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM, John Wesorick <john at wesorick.com
>     <mailto:john at wesorick.com>> wrote:
>
>         So Ubuntu announced their Mobile OS today. Not the Ubuntu for
>         Android, but a full OS. Here's a link to the
>         video, http://youtu.be/cpWHJDLsqTU?t=6m30s I had read that
>         they will be releasing images for Nexus devices in the coming
>         weeks. Anyone else thinks it's worth a try?
>
>         _______________________________________________
>         grlug mailing list
>         grlug at grlug.org <mailto:grlug at grlug.org>
>         http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     grlug mailing list
>     grlug at grlug.org <mailto:grlug at grlug.org>
>     http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

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From john at wesorick.com  Thu Jan  3 11:14:20 2013
From: john at wesorick.com (John Wesorick)
Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 11:14:20 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Ubuntu Mobile OS
In-Reply-To: <50E5A6E9.4020504@earthlink.net>
References: <CACrkP+HAJ_TsmgnLmbw4u5FexgzY+L0KFPD_jQBzdpLA63TcmA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAEmRL8X8o+Oi=mV=PrqOQS+mBR8C4zfCdcn0nyUcsQbBsQ_pjg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACrkP+EbnP68=S3Kn_M4-S_QuOXZUPcNFwJRhzpSWkD5yzMvDQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <50E5A6E9.4020504@earthlink.net>
Message-ID: <CACrkP+GEq4XV=L3rGfu6+rHCPkWxrf_szq5MTe8vvYRPvfqzVA@mail.gmail.com>

The other thing I like is the idea of being able to dock my phone and use
it as my desktop (i.e. with a full desktop OS, not a mobile
OS that's bigger). My phone is nearly as fast as my daily use laptop. I'm
sure my next phone will be much faster. As far as I know, Ubuntu mobile is
just a DE for an existing OS, so there isn't as much manpower necessary to
keep it developed. Whether or not it has staying power is irrelevant. It's
fun to have choice and try new things. If it sucks, I can always put
Android back on my phone. This is why a lot of people choose Linux to begin
with. Don't like Ubuntu? Try Suse, Fedora, Mint, Debian, etc. etc.  At any
rate, I'm not trying to start a flameware or anything, I just thought that
you guys and gals would find it interesting.


On Thu, Jan 3, 2013 at 10:42 AM, Kyle <dontwantspam1 at earthlink.net> wrote:

>  Freedom and Choice are both largely true of Android, Open webOS, Firefox
> OS, Meego, and Tizen.  Cross-platform app design is true of Open webOS,
> Firefox OS, and Tizen, as well as probably others.  I don't mean to put
> them down for contributing to more Freedom and Choice, but as much market
> share as webOS lost, which for a while was well-supported by carriers, had
> a large Palm fanbase behind it, and sold reasonably well, Ubuntu Phone OS
> has a huge uphill battle ahead of them to develop a user base capable of
> sustaining a project like that into the future.
>
> My $0.02, for what it's worth.
>
> - Kyle
>
>
>
>
> On 01/03/2013 10:03 AM, John Wesorick wrote:
>
> Freedom. Choice. Truly cross-device app design. It doesn't need to be
> successful in an x% of marketshare way. We, as Linux users, got pretty
> excited when we had 1-2% marketshare on the desktop. TBH, I'm more excited
> about Ubuntu for Android, but I'm definitely going to try this out once
> they release the image for my phone.
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 9:53 PM, Jonathan Jesse <jjesse at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Why?  This is the question I'm asking....  What will make this
>> device successful in the tight market that is already dominated by Android
>> and iOS with Blackberry and Windows Phone trailing in 3rd place.  I don't
>> think the "geeks" will rush out to adopt this phone as there seems to be
>> declining excitement in things Canonical/Ubuntu related.
>> There doesn't seem to be a committed carrier either which I think won't
>> drive adoption as well.  If they can't get VZW or AT&T selling/pushing this
>> phone then it will have even worse traction in the US than Windows Phone.
>>
>>  Or is it all an Europe/Asia thing?
>>
>>
>>  On Wed, Jan 2, 2013 at 3:54 PM, John Wesorick <john at wesorick.com> wrote:
>>
>>>  So Ubuntu announced their Mobile OS today. Not the Ubuntu for Android,
>>> but a full OS. Here's a link to the video,
>>> http://youtu.be/cpWHJDLsqTU?t=6m30s I had read that they will be
>>> releasing images for Nexus devices in the coming weeks. Anyone else thinks
>>> it's worth a try?
>>>
>>>  _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing listgrlug at grlug.orghttp://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From casey at grlug.org  Thu Jan  3 13:40:16 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Thu, 3 Jan 2013 13:40:16 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Meeting next Wednesday January 9th - mark
	your calendars
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZGwyEk9im0cmRBMqaXaZGtfSWACzJT0P2b43e4XAJnOYg@mail.gmail.com>

Hey All,

Last night's GRLUG/GRMakers social had over 25 people and was a TON of fun
THANK YOU to all that attended and if you haven't been to a meeting YOU
NEED TO COME!!!

Next week's meeting is Wednesday January 9th so PLEASE mark your calendars
NOW...

The Location is: *The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin St., Jenison and **Here's the
agenda:*

6-8PM GRMobile Dev meeting (
http://www.meetup.com/Grand-Rapids-Mobile-Development-Group/)

8PM till WHENEVER!!!!! GRLUG/GRMakers meeting
GRMakers email list/google Group @
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers

I am asking for everyone's participation as we NEED to get the 2-V2
Photobooths finished before Startup weekend. We're working on laser cutting
a couple new side panels and I'll have the Pipe and we've got the fabric so
all we have to do is put it together :-).


We should have most of the parts in for our RepRap printer and Dean has his
new printer up and running and we're hoping he can bring it to show off.



The GRLUG/GRMakers social is for ALL of us and you are all encouraged to
bring any projects you are working on and want to show off or that you need
help with, members have used The Warehouse to do a simple oil change or
weld something.



Here's a short list of gear that is available:

Large heated warehouse that you can pull a car into

Welders

Torch

Vehicle Ramps

ForkLift

Table Saw

Wood Planer

Compressor

Air tools
Hand tools

Grand Rapids Startup Weekend is January 18th
http://grandrapids.startupweekend.org/  and I'm encouraging EVERYONE to
register and attend! Please bring your ideas and can all work together to
bring them to life (We came up with a great idea last night that we will
present so having more people there means we can get it voted IN).

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 15:02:57 2013
From: edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com (Edward Crawford)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 15:02:57 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Taking suggestions for a router.
Message-ID: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>

I have a friend that has Charter internet service. She needs a router to
provide WiFi. She's elderly and on a tight budget. She lives in a mobile
home so range shouldn't be a big factor. Does anyone have a router they
would suggest for her situation?

Thanks for the help!

Best Regards,

ejc (Edward Crawford)
edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com
616 329 5294
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From mikemol at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 15:13:11 2013
From: mikemol at gmail.com (Michael Mol)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 15:13:11 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Taking suggestions for a router.
In-Reply-To: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+czFiCfq_dO0g=gGR=xeqvzsmE9Fvu61=9rNiqvZqD+_HNiCA@mail.gmail.com>

On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Edward Crawford
<edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com> wrote:
> I have a friend that has Charter internet service. She needs a router to
> provide WiFi. She's elderly and on a tight budget. She lives in a mobile
> home so range shouldn't be a big factor. Does anyone have a router they
> would suggest for her situation?
>
> Thanks for the help!

If integral modem is needed, any cheap DOCSIS 3 router will suffice.

If the modem is separate, than any cheap router will suffice.

There just isn't very much differentiation at the low end.

--
:wq

From ben.demott at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 15:28:05 2013
From: ben.demott at gmail.com (Ben DeMott)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 15:28:05 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Taking suggestions for a router.
In-Reply-To: <CA+czFiCfq_dO0g=gGR=xeqvzsmE9Fvu61=9rNiqvZqD+_HNiCA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CA+czFiCfq_dO0g=gGR=xeqvzsmE9Fvu61=9rNiqvZqD+_HNiCA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACbtCQ2XF3upLOad5vr-UQX5SSuN2Fzy4dDzQkhT-eRRLsynow@mail.gmail.com>

I have a belkin that was really inexpensive - it's worked the longest and
best of any router I've owned.


On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:13 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Edward Crawford
> <edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I have a friend that has Charter internet service. She needs a router to
> > provide WiFi. She's elderly and on a tight budget. She lives in a mobile
> > home so range shouldn't be a big factor. Does anyone have a router they
> > would suggest for her situation?
> >
> > Thanks for the help!
>
> If integral modem is needed, any cheap DOCSIS 3 router will suffice.
>
> If the modem is separate, than any cheap router will suffice.
>
> There just isn't very much differentiation at the low end.
>
> --
> :wq
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From don.ellis at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 17:25:40 2013
From: don.ellis at gmail.com (Don Ellis)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 16:25:40 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Taking suggestions for a router.
In-Reply-To: <CACbtCQ2XF3upLOad5vr-UQX5SSuN2Fzy4dDzQkhT-eRRLsynow@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CA+czFiCfq_dO0g=gGR=xeqvzsmE9Fvu61=9rNiqvZqD+_HNiCA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ2XF3upLOad5vr-UQX5SSuN2Fzy4dDzQkhT-eRRLsynow@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALKyAeum3mw-5x=qejMz83RLn5QrpDP+L88amZTTCNt-m_3fsA@mail.gmail.com>

Probably best to go with a known brand name (Belkin, Linksys, D-Link,
Trendnet, pretty long list of others). Some out there are really less
expensive to purchase but may not be so easy/reliable.

I've had pretty good results with Linksys, currently using a D-Link as
primary router/AP, with other Linksys APs. I like the idea of separate
router/modem modules, since failure of one doesn't require replacement
of both. Might be less expensive initially to get combination, though.
If it lasts long enough, the cost is amortized. Sometimes one
component fails and another continues to work. I have an AP whose
wireless no longer works, but the switch function is just fine. Also
have one whose VOIP continues to work, but I've stopped using its
switch/AP functions (I think that's the one with the bad AP function).

Perhaps one benefit of Linksys is that there are a lot of older units
out there and they can be picked up used/modified for very good price
(or free, as I've gotten several).

Also, wondering about getting DOCSYS 3 for my Charter connection. Have
heard that getting it through Charter is mandatory, but don't think
they would have anything to say if I just plugged one in. When I
called for an outage recently, they said my modem was not DOCSYS 3, so
I needed to replace it, though it had been working earlier that day.
Before call ended, they got notified that there was an outage, so they
dropped the subject.

--Don Ellis


On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 2:28 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:
> I have a belkin that was really inexpensive - it's worked the longest and
> best of any router I've owned.
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:13 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Edward Crawford
>> <edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com> wrote:
>> > I have a friend that has Charter internet service. She needs a router to
>> > provide WiFi. She's elderly and on a tight budget. She lives in a mobile
>> > home so range shouldn't be a big factor. Does anyone have a router they
>> > would suggest for her situation?
>> >
>> > Thanks for the help!
>>
>> If integral modem is needed, any cheap DOCSIS 3 router will suffice.
>>
>> If the modem is separate, than any cheap router will suffice.
>>
>> There just isn't very much differentiation at the low end.
>>
>> --
>> :wq
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From jdburnz at gmail.com  Fri Jan  4 17:59:37 2013
From: jdburnz at gmail.com (Joshua Burns)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 17:59:37 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Taking suggestions for a router.
In-Reply-To: <CALKyAeum3mw-5x=qejMz83RLn5QrpDP+L88amZTTCNt-m_3fsA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAAzTyD5d5dnPB=w5pihGQem2z6sVF2skHqnPqPth7qV+4Qqb7Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CA+czFiCfq_dO0g=gGR=xeqvzsmE9Fvu61=9rNiqvZqD+_HNiCA@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ2XF3upLOad5vr-UQX5SSuN2Fzy4dDzQkhT-eRRLsynow@mail.gmail.com>
 <CALKyAeum3mw-5x=qejMz83RLn5QrpDP+L88amZTTCNt-m_3fsA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB73KvSBi9aGD0QWwTQ+MmuU085-WVofFD37SQJ-Z0ihueSw4w@mail.gmail.com>

I have a Linksys set up here, running DD-WRT (linux firmware) which works
GREAT! Pretty much eliminates all the problems I had with the original
Linksys firmware (rebooting randomly, randomly dropping connection, etc)



On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 5:25 PM, Don Ellis <don.ellis at gmail.com> wrote:

> Probably best to go with a known brand name (Belkin, Linksys, D-Link,
> Trendnet, pretty long list of others). Some out there are really less
> expensive to purchase but may not be so easy/reliable.
>
> I've had pretty good results with Linksys, currently using a D-Link as
> primary router/AP, with other Linksys APs. I like the idea of separate
> router/modem modules, since failure of one doesn't require replacement
> of both. Might be less expensive initially to get combination, though.
> If it lasts long enough, the cost is amortized. Sometimes one
> component fails and another continues to work. I have an AP whose
> wireless no longer works, but the switch function is just fine. Also
> have one whose VOIP continues to work, but I've stopped using its
> switch/AP functions (I think that's the one with the bad AP function).
>
> Perhaps one benefit of Linksys is that there are a lot of older units
> out there and they can be picked up used/modified for very good price
> (or free, as I've gotten several).
>
> Also, wondering about getting DOCSYS 3 for my Charter connection. Have
> heard that getting it through Charter is mandatory, but don't think
> they would have anything to say if I just plugged one in. When I
> called for an outage recently, they said my modem was not DOCSYS 3, so
> I needed to replace it, though it had been working earlier that day.
> Before call ended, they got notified that there was an outage, so they
> dropped the subject.
>
> --Don Ellis
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 2:28 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:
> > I have a belkin that was really inexpensive - it's worked the longest and
> > best of any router I've owned.
> >
> >
> > On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:13 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>
> >> On Fri, Jan 4, 2013 at 3:02 PM, Edward Crawford
> >> <edwardjoncrawford at gmail.com> wrote:
> >> > I have a friend that has Charter internet service. She needs a router
> to
> >> > provide WiFi. She's elderly and on a tight budget. She lives in a
> mobile
> >> > home so range shouldn't be a big factor. Does anyone have a router
> they
> >> > would suggest for her situation?
> >> >
> >> > Thanks for the help!
> >>
> >> If integral modem is needed, any cheap DOCSIS 3 router will suffice.
> >>
> >> If the modem is separate, than any cheap router will suffice.
> >>
> >> There just isn't very much differentiation at the low end.
> >>
> >> --
> >> :wq
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> grlug mailing list
> >> grlug at grlug.org
> >> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> >
> >
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > grlug mailing list
> > grlug at grlug.org
> > http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From desertfrag at yahoo.com  Fri Jan  4 18:37:55 2013
From: desertfrag at yahoo.com (desert frag)
Date: Fri, 4 Jan 2013 15:37:55 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Volume of updates
Message-ID: <1357342675.39072.YahooMailNeo@web162405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

Has the frequency and volume of updates with various distros increased or decreased over the years?? After a long hiatus I installed CentOS and various Ubuntu based versions a few months back thinking that many of the tweaks, improvements, security measures, etc had been refined, to the point that I hadn't expected much in the way of updates as in years past.? I don't run that many programs but find myself surprised by how many new updates are available, far more than a typical Windows system has.? Many of them seem to be security related, suggesting there's holes than seem to continuously crop up.? What exactly is going on? ? 
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From mike.english at gmail.com  Sat Jan  5 10:40:53 2013
From: mike.english at gmail.com (Mike English)
Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 10:40:53 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Educational games for Linux
Message-ID: <CAHhBnk=PxMPHiV6Sregh0Kd__1JO9UJp9QLgooEHMMCdicS31Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hi,

I have an old netbook I'm considering letting my kids start using as they
get older (both are <2 now). I figured this list would be a good place to
ask about quality educational games available for Linux. FWIW, the netbook
is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS.

-Mike


-- 
Mike English
+1 (616) 723-0277
http://mikeenglish.net
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From brousch at gmail.com  Sat Jan  5 11:36:01 2013
From: brousch at gmail.com (Ben Rousch)
Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 11:36:01 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Educational games for Linux
In-Reply-To: <CAHhBnk=PxMPHiV6Sregh0Kd__1JO9UJp9QLgooEHMMCdicS31Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHhBnk=PxMPHiV6Sregh0Kd__1JO9UJp9QLgooEHMMCdicS31Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOPHfB1Wbq=poV4nk5oi9e2RPOZmuPZCbtEYZhYQfxuVu16Utg@mail.gmail.com>

My son started with Edubuntu, which is a kid-oriented version of
Ubuntu, when he was about 2 years old. He especially liked TuxPaint
and Gcompris, though it didn't fit perfectly on the small netbook he
was using at the time. Since then he has moved up to the games at PBS
Kids and Nick Jr. They are mostly flash games. He now prefers Android
games. He has an old phone of mine and borrows a tablet. There a lot
more kid-friendly games on Android.

On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Mike English <mike.english at gmail.com> wrote:
> Hi,
>
> I have an old netbook I'm considering letting my kids start using as they
> get older (both are <2 now). I figured this list would be a good place to
> ask about quality educational games available for Linux. FWIW, the netbook
> is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS.
>
> -Mike
>
>
> --
> Mike English
> +1 (616) 723-0277
> http://mikeenglish.net
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug



-- 
 Ben Rousch
   brousch at gmail.com
   http://clusterbleep.net/

From lord.drachenblut at gmail.com  Sat Jan  5 16:39:21 2013
From: lord.drachenblut at gmail.com (Lord Drachenblut)
Date: Sat, 5 Jan 2013 16:39:21 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Educational games for Linux
In-Reply-To: <CAOPHfB1Wbq=poV4nk5oi9e2RPOZmuPZCbtEYZhYQfxuVu16Utg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAHhBnk=PxMPHiV6Sregh0Kd__1JO9UJp9QLgooEHMMCdicS31Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAOPHfB1Wbq=poV4nk5oi9e2RPOZmuPZCbtEYZhYQfxuVu16Utg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAG58yKvXgA5wPkFonUY2_9h-5pJ27R=6ZKDGyKKkMHd14z25SQ@mail.gmail.com>

Two pages to look at

http://www.lifehack.org/articles/technology/linux-for-children.html

http://www.junauza.com/2011/08/best-linux-distributions-for-kids-and.html?m=1
On Jan 5, 2013 11:36 AM, "Ben Rousch" <brousch at gmail.com> wrote:

> My son started with Edubuntu, which is a kid-oriented version of
> Ubuntu, when he was about 2 years old. He especially liked TuxPaint
> and Gcompris, though it didn't fit perfectly on the small netbook he
> was using at the time. Since then he has moved up to the games at PBS
> Kids and Nick Jr. They are mostly flash games. He now prefers Android
> games. He has an old phone of mine and borrows a tablet. There a lot
> more kid-friendly games on Android.
>
> On Sat, Jan 5, 2013 at 10:40 AM, Mike English <mike.english at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Hi,
> >
> > I have an old netbook I'm considering letting my kids start using as they
> > get older (both are <2 now). I figured this list would be a good place to
> > ask about quality educational games available for Linux. FWIW, the
> netbook
> > is currently running Ubuntu 12.04 LTS.
> >
> > -Mike
> >
> >
> > --
> > Mike English
> > +1 (616) 723-0277
> > http://mikeenglish.net
> >
> > _______________________________________________
> > grlug mailing list
> > grlug at grlug.org
> > http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
> --
>  Ben Rousch
>    brousch at gmail.com
>    http://clusterbleep.net/
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From awilliam at whitemice.org  Sat Jan  5 17:49:47 2013
From: awilliam at whitemice.org (Adam Tauno Williams)
Date: Sat, 05 Jan 2013 17:49:47 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Volume of updates
In-Reply-To: <1357342675.39072.YahooMailNeo@web162405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <1357342675.39072.YahooMailNeo@web162405.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <1357426187.2938.16.camel@p105s6207.site>

On Fri, 2013-01-04 at 15:37 -0800, desert frag wrote:
> Has the frequency and volume of updates with various distros increased
> or decreased over the years? 

No, I don't think so.  To some degree the simple number of packages has
increased, so that brings with it a natural rise of the tide [as older
packages also continue to get updates].

>  After a long hiatus I installed CentOS and various Ubuntu based
> versions a few months back thinking that many of the tweaks,
> improvements, security measures, etc had been refined, to the point
> that I hadn't expected much in the way of updates as in years past.  I
> don't run that many programs but find myself surprised by how many new
> updates are available, far more than a typical Windows system has.
> Many of them seem to be security related, suggesting there's holes
> than seem to continuously crop up.  What exactly is going on? 

(a) I don't believe the volume of updates between LINUX-disto and
Windows differ that much.
  (a.1.) Windows releases most updates on a schedule, only very critical
updates break the schedule.  So the stream of updates for a LINUX-distro
seems more constant
  (a.2.) Windows updates are larger and target entire subsystems,
whereas LINUX-distro package are much more granular.  So again, the
number of updates is higher.  I'm not sure the volume of 'data' is
higher.  ".NET" at least receives a pretty steady stream of large-is
updates.
(b) An average LINUX distro install provides *WAY MORE* software than a
typical Windows install [sigh.... just try actually *using* a Windows
machine to grind some vendor or suppliers data once you've us LINUX for
a few years.... Argh!  One wonders how one accomplishes anything like
real work on that platform].
(c) Updates as a security issue is *WAY* overblown IMNSHO.  Many
security updates address really corner cases that only apply to narrow
uses of specific packages under certain circumstances.  Microsoft would
bundle such fixes together; LINUX distributions tend to let the updates
flow out more granularly.

My advice is to not-update-urgently.  Updates, always, can break things,
and updates take time. So skip it.  I update my own stuff about once a
month, on a lazy Friday where if something does break I have time to
notice and address it.  Don't update Sunday night!

Watching LWN will typically tell you if there is a really urgent
security issue that needs to be addressed rapidly; but these are very
rare these days.  And even those frequently have a 'temporary' work
around.  

In general a good tiered design and use of tools like iptables and
SELinux / AppArmour are going to do 9,999,999,999,999^999 times more for
your security than 'staying-up-to-date'.  

A current but poorly configured system without lax user credentials IS
FAR MORE *INSECURE* than an older system properly configured with good
policies.




From merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com  Sun Jan  6 11:40:33 2013
From: merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com (Matt Merrell Sr.)
Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 08:40:33 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
Message-ID: <1357490433.11554.YahooMailNeo@web161003.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

http://www.uldy.org/wmnpw.php?gnpz=gnpz
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From merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com  Sun Jan  6 23:03:25 2013
From: merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com (Matt Merrell Sr.)
Date: Sun, 6 Jan 2013 20:03:25 -0800 (PST)
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
Message-ID: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>

http://property-investor.net/Templates/wmnhl.php?trkx=trkx
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From leapole at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 00:32:26 2013
From: leapole at gmail.com (Josh)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 00:32:26 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
Message-ID: <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>

sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?


On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Matt Merrell Sr. <
merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com> wrote:

> http://property-investor.net/Templates/wmnhl.php?trkx=trkx
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From grlugcasey at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 00:56:23 2013
From: grlugcasey at gmail.com (Casey DuBois)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 00:56:23 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>

I thought I knew Everyone on the list but i dont know him. I'll give him a call tomorrow and decide if we need to remove him from the list. 

Regards,
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942

On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:32 AM, Josh <leapole at gmail.com> wrote:

> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
> 
> 
> On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Matt Merrell Sr. <merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com> wrote:
>> http://property-investor.net/Templates/wmnhl.php?trkx=trkx
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> 
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
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From rlauzon at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 05:03:45 2013
From: rlauzon at gmail.com (Ron Lauzon)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 05:03:45 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>

I'm getting similar spam from other people I know.

It looks like there's a virus going around - and it ain't the flu.


On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 12:56 AM, Casey DuBois <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:
> I thought I knew Everyone on the list but i dont know him. I'll give him a
> call tomorrow and decide if we need to remove him from the list.
>
> Regards,
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
>
> On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:32 AM, Josh <leapole at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
>
>
> On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Matt Merrell Sr.
> <merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>
>> http://property-investor.net/Templates/wmnhl.php?trkx=trkx
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug



-- 
Ron Lauzon - rlauzon at acm dot org
   Homepage: http://webpages.charter.net/rlauzon/
   Weblog: http://ronsapartment.blogspot.com/

   DNRC: Lord of All Things That Are Fattening

   "To be sure, conservative radio talk show hosts have a built-in
   audience unavailable to liberals: People driving cars to some
   sort of job." - Ann Coulter

Microsoft Free since July 06, 2001
Running Ubuntu 10.04 x86_64

From brousch at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 06:16:54 2013
From: brousch at gmail.com (Ben Rousch)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 06:16:54 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>
 <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAOPHfB05R4AU-OjQLsPeA-FzCz5Z0mcH94qZzqZMj=yw12G_Yg@mail.gmail.com>

It's not likely to be intentional spam, but a compromised Yahoo email
account. I see this kind of thing once a month and it's always with a
Yahoo account.

On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 5:03 AM, Ron Lauzon <rlauzon at gmail.com> wrote:
> I'm getting similar spam from other people I know.
>
> It looks like there's a virus going around - and it ain't the flu.
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 12:56 AM, Casey DuBois <grlugcasey at gmail.com> wrote:
>> I thought I knew Everyone on the list but i dont know him. I'll give him a
>> call tomorrow and decide if we need to remove him from the list.
>>
>> Regards,
>> Casey DuBois
>> 616-808-6942
>>
>> On Jan 7, 2013, at 12:32 AM, Josh <leapole at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
>>
>>
>> On Sun, Jan 6, 2013 at 11:03 PM, Matt Merrell Sr.
>> <merrellcustomtrim at yahoo.com> wrote:
>>>
>>> http://property-investor.net/Templates/wmnhl.php?trkx=trkx
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
> --
> Ron Lauzon - rlauzon at acm dot org
>    Homepage: http://webpages.charter.net/rlauzon/
>    Weblog: http://ronsapartment.blogspot.com/
>
>    DNRC: Lord of All Things That Are Fattening
>
>    "To be sure, conservative radio talk show hosts have a built-in
>    audience unavailable to liberals: People driving cars to some
>    sort of job." - Ann Coulter
>
> Microsoft Free since July 06, 2001
> Running Ubuntu 10.04 x86_64
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug



-- 
 Ben Rousch
   brousch at gmail.com
   http://clusterbleep.net/

From jtr at jrichards.org  Mon Jan  7 08:01:09 2013
From: jtr at jrichards.org (John-Thomas Richards)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:01:09 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>
 <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20130107130109.GA2092@rondo.celtics>

On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 05:03:45AM -0500, Ron Lauzon wrote:
> I'm getting similar spam from other people I know.
> 
> It looks like there's a virus going around - and it ain't the flu.

I've noticed a huge increase in spam over the past few days.
-- 
john-thomas
------
If money be not thy servant, it will be thy master. The covetous man
cannot so properly be said to possess wealth, as that may be said to
possess him.
Francis Bacon, essayist, philosopher, and statesman (1561-1626)

From jtr at jrichards.org  Mon Jan  7 08:02:37 2013
From: jtr at jrichards.org (John-Thomas Richards)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:02:37 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <20130107130237.GB2092@rondo.celtics>

On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 12:32:26AM -0500, Josh wrote:
> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?

I received another spam from him mailed directly to me...and the Ubuntu
News list. :)

Heh.
-- 
john-thomas
------
If what you are getting online is for free, you are not the customer, you
are the product.
Jonathan Zittrain, professor of Internet law (b. 1969)

From topher at codeventure.net  Mon Jan  7 08:04:11 2013
From: topher at codeventure.net (Topher)
Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 08:04:11 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <20130107130237.GB2092@rondo.celtics>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20130107130237.GB2092@rondo.celtics>
Message-ID: <50EAC7CB.4050801@codeventure.net>

On 01/07/2013 08:02 AM, John-Thomas Richards wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 12:32:26AM -0500, Josh wrote:
>> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
> 
> I received another spam from him mailed directly to me...and the Ubuntu
> News list. :)

There was a big rash of hacked Yahoo accounts the other day.  Several of
my clients sent me the same stuff and had no idea.

This person probably has no idea it's happening at all.


From edwardo.fuentes at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 08:28:13 2013
From: edwardo.fuentes at gmail.com (Edwardo Fuentes)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 08:28:13 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <50EAC7CB.4050801@codeventure.net>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20130107130237.GB2092@rondo.celtics>
 <50EAC7CB.4050801@codeventure.net>
Message-ID: <CAMHcArpT1NdKhs0K1oBCjBPJJ2cSLfjndijE1bbYhEG-+iZe4w@mail.gmail.com>

I had a few of these email in the last week also.  Tried  to change my
yahoo password using last pass.  A 25 character password with special
symbols, uppercase letters & numbers ; randomly generated was flagged as
"weak" would not allow me to advance.  I decided to terminate my yahoo
account.


Edwardo
616.834.3023


On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Topher <topher at codeventure.net> wrote:

> On 01/07/2013 08:02 AM, John-Thomas Richards wrote:
> > On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 12:32:26AM -0500, Josh wrote:
> >> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
> >
> > I received another spam from him mailed directly to me...and the Ubuntu
> > News list. :)
>
> There was a big rash of hacked Yahoo accounts the other day.  Several of
> my clients sent me the same stuff and had no idea.
>
> This person probably has no idea it's happening at all.
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From awilliam at whitemice.org  Mon Jan  7 08:30:12 2013
From: awilliam at whitemice.org (Adam Tauno Williams)
Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 08:30:12 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <20130107130109.GA2092@rondo.celtics>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <2F2C9885-62BF-4757-8866-AA360DE5B3AC@gmail.com>
 <CAJwpJybWxtOqP7dEgzvoPYPNJte7C9iACi0DS9WP2y1mBw45eQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20130107130109.GA2092@rondo.celtics>
Message-ID: <1357565412.2757.0.camel@localhost>

On Mon, 2013-01-07 at 08:01 -0500, John-Thomas Richards wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 05:03:45AM -0500, Ron Lauzon wrote:
> > I'm getting similar spam from other people I know.
> > It looks like there's a virus going around - and it ain't the flu.
> I've noticed a huge increase in spam over the past few days.

I haven't seen any SPAM making it through [except this one and a couple
1-800 Flowers] in several days.  So it is localized somewhere.

-- 
Adam Tauno Williams  GPG D95ED383
Systems Administrator, Python Developer, LPI / NCLA


From knightperson at zuzax.com  Mon Jan  7 12:25:06 2013
From: knightperson at zuzax.com (Mike Williams)
Date: Mon, 07 Jan 2013 12:25:06 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] (no subject)
In-Reply-To: <CAMHcArpT1NdKhs0K1oBCjBPJJ2cSLfjndijE1bbYhEG-+iZe4w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <1357531405.15032.YahooMailNeo@web161005.mail.bf1.yahoo.com>
 <CADi8XRuLe2-UZwSf1fBYbkjL_HM38sghRONPeMzQiAC9NR=DMQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <20130107130237.GB2092@rondo.celtics> <50EAC7CB.4050801@codeventure.net>
 <CAMHcArpT1NdKhs0K1oBCjBPJJ2cSLfjndijE1bbYhEG-+iZe4w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <50EB04F2.6070305@zuzax.com>

Heehee. I would love to know what kind of equation they're using that 
calls that password "weak". Maybe it translates to "we store our 
passwords in plaintext and we can't handle one that long."

On 1/7/2013 8:28 AM, Edwardo Fuentes wrote:
> I had a few of these email in the last week also.  Tried  to change my 
> yahoo password using last pass.  A 25 character password with special 
> symbols, uppercase letters & numbers ; 
> randomly generated was flagged as "weak" would not allow me 
> to advance.  I decided to terminate my yahoo account.
>
>
> Edwardo
> 616.834.3023
>
>
> On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 8:04 AM, Topher <topher at codeventure.net 
> <mailto:topher at codeventure.net>> wrote:
>
>     On 01/07/2013 08:02 AM, John-Thomas Richards wrote:
>     > On Mon, Jan 07, 2013 at 12:32:26AM -0500, Josh wrote:
>     >> sweet we got a spammer -- are you sure you want to spam this list?
>     >
>     > I received another spam from him mailed directly to me...and the
>     Ubuntu
>     > News list. :)
>
>     There was a big rash of hacked Yahoo accounts the other day.
>      Several of
>     my clients sent me the same stuff and had no idea.
>
>     This person probably has no idea it's happening at all.
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     grlug mailing list
>     grlug at grlug.org <mailto:grlug at grlug.org>
>     http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

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From casey at grlug.org  Mon Jan  7 14:35:43 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 14:35:43 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Meeting THIS Wednesday January 9th - Calling
	ALL Makers!!
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZHmEr3UW3dekaNazy0sXW3fRti9H708XXJd8GmWNgXPCw@mail.gmail.com>

Last week's GRLUG/GRMakers social had over 25 people and was a TON of fun
THANK YOU to all that attended and if you haven't been to a meeting YOU
NEED TO COME!!!

This week's meeting is Wednesday January 9th @ *The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin
St., Jenison and **Here's the agenda:*

6-8PM GRMobile Dev meeting (
http://www.meetup.com/Grand-Rapids-Mobile-Development-Group/)

8PM till WHENEVER!!!!! GRLUG/GRMakers meeting
GRMakers email list/google Group @
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers

I am asking for everyone's participation as we NEED to get the 2-V2
Photobooths finished before Startup weekend. We're working on laser cutting
a couple new side panels and I'll have the Pipe and we've got the fabric so
all we have to do is put it together :-).


We should have most of the parts in for our RepRap printer and Dean has his
new printer up and running and we're hoping he can bring it to show off.



The GRLUG/GRMakers social is for ALL of us and you are all encouraged to
bring any projects you are working on and want to show off or that you need
help with, members have used The Warehouse to do a simple oil change or
weld something.



Here's a short list of gear that is available:

Large heated warehouse that you can pull a car into

Welders

Torch

Vehicle Ramps

ForkLift

Table Saw

Wood Planer

Compressor

Air tools
Hand tools

Grand Rapids Startup Weekend is January 18th
http://grandrapids.startupweekend.org/  and I'm encouraging EVERYONE to
register and attend! Please bring your ideas and can all work together to
bring them to life (We came up with a great idea last night that we will
present so having more people there means we can get it voted IN).

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From bob.kline at gmail.com  Mon Jan  7 15:04:03 2013
From: bob.kline at gmail.com (Bob Kline)
Date: Mon, 7 Jan 2013 15:04:03 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Meeting THIS Wednesday January 9th -
 Calling ALL Makers!!
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZHmEr3UW3dekaNazy0sXW3fRti9H708XXJd8GmWNgXPCw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZHmEr3UW3dekaNazy0sXW3fRti9H708XXJd8GmWNgXPCw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFOq4EJ=pfDxqNA3Nhvmbfi1p_zAZXVHT=Nev9o6vdj8Mof6TA@mail.gmail.com>

Hi Casey --

I've never been to your facility myself,
but it reads like a fabulous opportunity
for anyone the least bit serious about
Linux projects.  I built a large number of
small systems years ago, based on the
Motorola 68000 family of parts, as well
as Intel 8052AH-BASIC chips - floating
point.  But Linux was not available then,
and Unix was too expensive for the
hobbyist.  The opportunities today are
little short of breathtaking in comparision.

My father passed on a few years ago,
and if there is the need and-or demand
I might be able to supply to some parts
to the group.  Things like resistors and
transistors that one would use in interfaces.
We can talk about that some day.  I'd be
happy to see the stuff get some use.

Anyway, I haven't even heard of a
setup as plush as what you offer since
the days when I worked.  For those
gung-ho, it's really essentially a research
kind of environment, with all
of the expertise around, and facilities
available. Hopefully many people will
avail themselves of this splendid opportunity.

   -- Bob

On Mon, Jan 7, 2013 at 2:35 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> Last week's GRLUG/GRMakers social had over 25 people and was a TON of fun
> THANK YOU to all that attended and if you haven't been to a meeting YOU
> NEED TO COME!!!
>
> This week's meeting is Wednesday January 9th @ *The Warehouse, 112
> Baldwin St., Jenison and **Here's the agenda:*
>
> 6-8PM GRMobile Dev meeting (
> http://www.meetup.com/Grand-Rapids-Mobile-Development-Group/)
>
> 8PM till WHENEVER!!!!! GRLUG/GRMakers meeting
> GRMakers email list/google Group @
> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers
>
> I am asking for everyone's participation as we NEED to get the 2-V2
> Photobooths finished before Startup weekend. We're working on laser cutting
> a couple new side panels and I'll have the Pipe and we've got the fabric so
> all we have to do is put it together :-).
>
>
> We should have most of the parts in for our RepRap printer and Dean has
> his new printer up and running and we're hoping he can bring it to show
> off.
>
>
>
> The GRLUG/GRMakers social is for ALL of us and you are all encouraged to
> bring any projects you are working on and want to show off or that you need
> help with, members have used The Warehouse to do a simple oil change or
> weld something.
>
>
>
> Here's a short list of gear that is available:
>
> Large heated warehouse that you can pull a car into
>
> Welders
>
> Torch
>
> Vehicle Ramps
>
> ForkLift
>
> Table Saw
>
> Wood Planer
>
> Compressor
>
> Air tools
> Hand tools
>
> Grand Rapids Startup Weekend is January 18th
> http://grandrapids.startupweekend.org/  and I'm encouraging EVERYONE to
> register and attend! Please bring your ideas and can all work together to
> bring them to life (We came up with a great idea last night that we will
> present so having more people there means we can get it voted IN).
>
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
> casey at grlug.org
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From casey at grlug.org  Tue Jan  8 15:19:33 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 15:19:33 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Photo Booth Pictures
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZE4kz81ggy3WPJB4iJh7iP8itjrnjf2f_KEmntEGOyYLA@mail.gmail.com>

For those of you that have not attended any of the meetings here are some
pictures of the Photo Booth project.

V1 uses a Lenovo desktop loaded with Ubuntu and OpenPhotoBooth software
that MM has Forked, Unytouch 19" touchscreen, Logitec USB WebCam and a
color Laser printer that I have:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523792/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523316/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459425/in/photostream/

V2 will use the same Lenovo desktop unless we can get the OpenPhotoBooth
software running on the RaspberryPi, same Unytouch 19" touchscreen and
Logitec USB WebCam, we will need to figure out a smaller more portable
printer that can print on better quality paper in a smaller format (also
needs to fit inside of the RACK):
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459035/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362521718/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361457959/in/photostream/

V1 is a wooden frame painted and covered with cloth but V2 will be
installed in a RACK with wheels for easy transport of everything and the
frame will be modular (will use 1" and 2" conduit for this) so it can be
transported easily and setup by one person.

Please provide any comments or suggestions as this is a work in progress
and there is still time to make changes.

Any GRLUG or GRMakers members that help with the project will get to use
the PhotoBooth V2 for their own events.

The goal will be to take these PhotoBooths to all of the local events to
gain awareness for the GRLUG/GRMakers group and they will also be available
for rent to create a revenue stream so we can get a space.

We will not need a touchscreen for our V3 PhotoBooth as I have pre-ordered
a couple of these Leap Motion gesture control devices http://vrge.co/135ZXmL

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From philip.robar at gmail.com  Tue Jan  8 15:38:22 2013
From: philip.robar at gmail.com (Robar Philip)
Date: Tue, 8 Jan 2013 15:38:22 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Photo Booth Pictures
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZE4kz81ggy3WPJB4iJh7iP8itjrnjf2f_KEmntEGOyYLA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZE4kz81ggy3WPJB4iJh7iP8itjrnjf2f_KEmntEGOyYLA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <E2394F5D-22CB-40EA-96A3-407043B73986@gmail.com>


On Jan 8, 2013, at 3:19 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> ?we will need to figure out a smaller more portable printer that can print on better quality paper in a smaller format (also needs to fit inside of the RACK)

How about the Epson PhotoMate Charm? It prints 4x6 prints on photo quality paper. List price for the current model is $200 (Amazon new $168, used $120).

https://www.epson.com/cgi-bin/Store/PictureMate/pmHome.jsp

There are older models that you might be able to find for less.


Phil


From casey at grlug.org  Wed Jan  9 15:04:19 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 15:04:19 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Assembling a RepRap tonight @ The GRLUG/GRMakers Social
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZFR5Hu+yWThzxPhu3GmQhTT+=sacx4zcnKjX4VU63xiTg@mail.gmail.com>

Hey all,

Here's a picture of my pile of parts that will be used to make a Rep Rap 3D
printer TONIGHT: http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/

Last week's GRLUG/GRMakers social had over 25 people and was a TON of fun
THANK YOU to all that attended and if you haven't been to a meeting YOU
NEED TO COME!!!

This week's meeting is Wednesday January 9th @ *The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin
St., Jenison and **Here's the agenda:*

6-8PM GRMobile Dev meeting (
http://www.meetup.com/Grand-Rapids-Mobile-Development-Group/
)

8PM till WHENEVER!!!!! GRLUG/GRMakers meeting
GRMakers email list/google Group @
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers

We are also going to be working on the PhotoBooth V2 here are some pictures
of the Photo Booth project.


V1 uses a Lenovo desktop loaded with Ubuntu and OpenPhotoBooth software
that MM has Forked, Unytouch 19" touchscreen, Logitec USB WebCam and a
color Laser printer that I have:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523792/in/photostream
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523316/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459425/in/photostream/

V2 will use the same Lenovo desktop unless we can get the OpenPhotoBooth
software running on the RaspberryPi, same Unytouch 19" touchscreen and
Logitec USB WebCam, we will need to figure out a smaller more portable
printer that can print on better quality paper in a smaller format (also
needs to fit inside of the RACK):
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459035/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362521718/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361457959/in/photostream/




Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From ptenhoopen at gmail.com  Wed Jan  9 17:42:04 2013
From: ptenhoopen at gmail.com (Patrick TenHoopen)
Date: Wed, 9 Jan 2013 17:42:04 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Assembling a RepRap tonight @ The GRLUG/GRMakers Social
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZFR5Hu+yWThzxPhu3GmQhTT+=sacx4zcnKjX4VU63xiTg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZFR5Hu+yWThzxPhu3GmQhTT+=sacx4zcnKjX4VU63xiTg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAA4ca77tfO_rJt4EXcjcFCMyTQbamfR=SReoDNQkWia324M=LQ@mail.gmail.com>

Has anyone seen this?

Shoop! : Raspberry Pi - powered Photo Souvenir Printer
http://briandelacruzph.blogspot.co.uk/2012/08/shoop-raspberry-pi-powered-photo.html


On Wed, Jan 9, 2013 at 3:04 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> Hey all,
>
> Here's a picture of my pile of parts that will be used to make a Rep Rap
> 3D printer TONIGHT: http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/
>
> Last week's GRLUG/GRMakers social had over 25 people and was a TON of fun
> THANK YOU to all that attended and if you haven't been to a meeting YOU
> NEED TO COME!!!
>
> This week's meeting is Wednesday January 9th @ *The Warehouse, 112
> Baldwin St., Jenison and **Here's the agenda:*
>
> 6-8PM GRMobile Dev meeting (
> http://www.meetup.com/Grand-Rapids-Mobile-Development-Group/
> )
>
> 8PM till WHENEVER!!!!! GRLUG/GRMakers meeting
> GRMakers email list/google Group @
> https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers
>
> We are also going to be working on the PhotoBooth V2 here are some
> pictures of the Photo Booth project.
>
>
> V1 uses a Lenovo desktop loaded with Ubuntu and OpenPhotoBooth software
> that MM has Forked, Unytouch 19" touchscreen, Logitec USB WebCam and a
> color Laser printer that I have:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523792/in/photostream
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362523316/in/photostream/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459425/in/photostream/
>
> V2 will use the same Lenovo desktop unless we can get the OpenPhotoBooth
> software running on the RaspberryPi, same Unytouch 19" touchscreen and
> Logitec USB WebCam, we will need to figure out a smaller more portable
> printer that can print on better quality paper in a smaller format (also
> needs to fit inside of the RACK):
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361459035/in/photostream/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362521718/in/photostream/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8361457959/in/photostream/
>
>
>
>
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
> casey at grlug.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>



-- 
END OF LINE.
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From brousch at gmail.com  Thu Jan 10 10:43:50 2013
From: brousch at gmail.com (Ben Rousch)
Date: Thu, 10 Jan 2013 10:43:50 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] You should present at GRDevDay
Message-ID: <CAOPHfB2uE-mWinY8j6Sa6zr+Fo6hjsggS43c96gb6fqAVCn_eQ@mail.gmail.com>

TL;DR
GRDevDay is a one day conference scheduled for Saturday, March 2,
2013. Talk proposal submissions are due Sunday.

I saw a lot of good presentations at user group meetings and at
BarCampGR in the last year, and I'd love to see many of those talks
refined and expanded for the upcoming GRDevDay conference. GRDevDay is
one of the few local conferences that brings together people from
disparate tech communities. Attending is a great way to expand your
horizons while learning from smart, enthusiastic developers from
languages and technologies you may not get to play with very often.
Presenting there is a great way to expose people you don't often get
to meet to your own awesome experiences and technologies. If you've
given a talk in the last year, you should consider dusting off your
slides, bringing them up to date, and presenting them to the wider
West MI development community.  Sunday is the deadline for submitting
talk proposals,

For more about GRDevDay, visit http://grdevday.org/
To submit your talk proposal, visit http://grdevday.org/Speakers.aspx

-- 
 Ben Rousch
   brousch at gmail.com
   http://clusterbleep.net/

From casey at grlug.org  Mon Jan 14 11:39:58 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Mon, 14 Jan 2013 11:39:58 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Grand Rapids Startup Weekend Registration
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZFdLy1w1SM=hzwi5QcbhtHXp74SCw_ki18pFax=ZJfQKQ@mail.gmail.com>

I need everyone to *REGISTER* for Startup weekend so we can get your name
badges printed (and so we don't run out of food and drinks).

Please enter the following promotional code for 20% OFF: *swgrcasey*

Several of you have offered to assist with organization and here's your
link: Organizers ?
http://swgrandrapids.eventbrite.com/?access=SWGR13organizer FREE.

Grand Rapids Startup Weekend @ The Factory
Friday, January 18, 2013 at 6:00 PM - Sunday, January 20, 2013 at 4:00 PM
(EST)
http://grandrapids.startupweekend.org/

Please contact me with any questions or concerns.

Regards,
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From geer at umich.edu  Tue Jan 15 22:58:07 2013
From: geer at umich.edu (Rob Geer)
Date: Tue, 15 Jan 2013 22:58:07 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Fwd: GR DevDay Committee invites you to GR DevDay 2013 (Mar
	2, 2013)
In-Reply-To: <20130116034052.ABB244A12A@prod-djcore-www19.evbops.com>
References: <20130116034052.ABB244A12A@prod-djcore-www19.evbops.com>
Message-ID: <CANub6JufQ=-gJJw4ufEudjqdjDeWq6vwzrKybCQBAm50bMDMfg@mail.gmail.com>

Wanted to share for any developers that may be interested.
Rob

---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: GR DevDay Committee <invite at eventbrite.com>
Date: Tue, Jan 15, 2013 at 10:40 PM
Subject: GR DevDay Committee invites you to GR DevDay 2013 (Mar 2, 2013)
To: geer1995 at gmail.com


**


* Hello Rob, *
 You are invited to the following event:
 GR DevDay 2013
<http://www.eventbrite.com/event/5090517876/?ref=enivtefor001&invite=Mjk1NjI2OC9nZWVyMTk5NUBnbWFpbC5jb20vMA%3D%3D&utm_source=eb_email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=inviteformal001&utm_term=eventpage>
 [image: divider]

Event to be held at the following time, date, and location:
   <http://www.eventbrite.com/event/5090517876/?ref=enivtefor001&invite=Mjk1NjI2OC9nZWVyMTk5NUBnbWFpbC5jb20vMA%3D%3D&utm_source=eb_email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=invitenew&utm_term=eventimage&ref=enivtefor001>

Saturday, March 2, 2013 from 8:30 AM to 5:15 PM (PST)

*Calvin College*
1734 Knollcrest Circle Southeast
Grand Rapids, MI 49506

View Map<http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1734+Knollcrest+Circle+Southeast,+Grand+Rapids,+MI+49506+United+States&hl=en>

 * Attend Event *
<http://www.eventbrite.com/event/5090517876/?ref=enivtefor001&invite=Mjk1NjI2OC9nZWVyMTk5NUBnbWFpbC5jb20vMA%3D%3D&utm_source=eb_email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=inviteformalv2&utm_term=attend&ref=enivtefor001>

*Share this event:*
 [image: Facebook]
<http://www.facebook.com/share.php?u=http%3A%2F%2Fgrdevday2013.eventbrite.com%2F%3Fref%3Desfbenivtefor001>
[image:
Twitter]
<http://twitter.com/home?status=I%27m+attending+GR+DevDay+2013+--+http%3A%2F%2Fwww.eventbrite.com%2Fs%2Fc0Xyenivtefor001>
[image:
LinkedIn]
<http://www.linkedin.com/shareArticle?mini=true&url=http%3A%2F%2Fgrdevday2013.eventbrite.com%2F%3Fref%3Deslienivtefor001&title=GR+DevDay+2013&summary=%5BMar+2%2C+2013%5D+-+%5BCalvin+College+-+1734+Knollcrest+Circle+Southeast+-+Grand+Rapids%2C+MI+49506%5D+-+%5BGR+DevDay+Committee%5D&source=Eventbrite>
  [image: divider]

GR DevDay is a one-day software development conference in Grand Rapids, MI.
It is volunteer-run and organized by developers with other developers in
mind. GR DevDay is proud to offer all this at a very low cost to
professionals and completely...
Read More<http://www.eventbrite.com/event/5090517876/?ref=enivtefor001&utm_source=eb_email&utm_media=email&utm_compaign=inviteformalv2&utm_term=readmore&invite=null>

Share this event on
Facebook<http://www.facebook.com/share.php?u=http%3A//grdevday2013.eventbrite.com/%3Fref%3Desfb>and
Twitter<http://twitter.com/home?status=http%3A//grdevday2013.eventbrite.com/%3Fref%3Destw>

We hope you can make it!

Cheers,
GR DevDay Committee

      [image: eventbrite]

 [image: Eventbrite]
<http://www.eventbrite.com/r/enivtefor001?utm_source=eb_email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=inviteformal&utm_term=eblogofooter>

 [image: Eventbrite]
<http://www.eventbrite.com/home/?ref=eemail&utm_source=eb_email&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=invite&utm_term=footer_invite>
  Eventbrite
| 651 Brannan St. Suite 110 | San Francisco, CA 94107
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From casey at grlug.org  Wed Jan 16 14:04:14 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 14:04:14 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Social TONIGHT from 8PM till Whenever
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZE6rksB+VHt9TMqtb+6j-NXbNkju6az8h-bfPZLt-CspQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hey all,

YES there is a GRLUG/GRMakers Social Tonight from 8PM till Whenever.

Startup Weekend starts this Friday so tonight we will be making the Name
Tags for the event.

We were able to get the Raspberry Pi to run the photobooth but since it is
extremely slow tonight's plan will be to get one lenovo running a dual
display photobooth and finish up the framing and sew the curtains for this
weekend's event.

I have not had a chance to get all of the 3D printer parts ordered so it
looks like we won't be making any more progress on this project till next
week when I should have the last of the items to finish the machine.

We received a large donation of chips for tonights event but I did not get
any food so please eat before you come.

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From don.ellis at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 21:29:59 2013
From: don.ellis at gmail.com (Don Ellis)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 20:29:59 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
Message-ID: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>

We have a network set up with two subnets behind a NAT. We are able to
get out of the network from either subnet.

What we want to do is be able to connect between a system on one
subnet and a system on the other subnet.

Does anyone have examples of doing this using iptables?

systemA in subnet0: 10.0.1.200
systemB in subnet1: 10.0.3.200

I have tried making changes in the iptables configuration, but I don't
have enough experience in iptables to know where to use -i, -o, -d,
and -s (I think those are the values to be adjusted here). Also, I'm
making assumptions about what table and chain the rules need to be
added to, and when to append (-A) and when to insert (-I).

Except for my first adjustment to something someone else had done
wrong, my shooting in the dark has had no results.

TIA,

--Don Ellis

From megadave at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 21:41:16 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:41:16 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>

iptables is firewalling, not routing

If the same router is doing the NAT for both networks, it should also
support routing between them, I would think by default.

If you are using both of these on the same physical/logical network
segment, that is going to be very inefficient - it would make more
sense to adjust the netmask so that you had one larger "subnet" and
all systems on the inside would be able to directly address each
other.

For the specific example you give below, if you are using
255.255.255.0 as a netmask, if you adjust the netmask on ALL devices
to 255.255.248.0 that will give you one subnet with addresses ranging
from 10.0.0.1 through 10.0.3.254 all directly addressable to each
other.


On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Don Ellis <don.ellis at gmail.com> wrote:
> We have a network set up with two subnets behind a NAT. We are able to
> get out of the network from either subnet.
>
> What we want to do is be able to connect between a system on one
> subnet and a system on the other subnet.
>
> Does anyone have examples of doing this using iptables?
>
> systemA in subnet0: 10.0.1.200
> systemB in subnet1: 10.0.3.200
>
> I have tried making changes in the iptables configuration, but I don't
> have enough experience in iptables to know where to use -i, -o, -d,
> and -s (I think those are the values to be adjusted here). Also, I'm
> making assumptions about what table and chain the rules need to be
> added to, and when to append (-A) and when to insert (-I).
>
> Except for my first adjustment to something someone else had done
> wrong, my shooting in the dark has had no results.
>
> TIA,
>
> --Don Ellis
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From megadave at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 21:43:25 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:43:25 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>

Forgot to add, if they are on seperate network segments, then check
the router that physically interconnects them and see if it needs to
be configured to do routing between the two (without doing any NAT of
course)

If you re using two separate routers, then you'll need to add a router
with a specific configuration (eg, *not* the normal nat/firewall
setup) between the two networks.

On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 9:41 PM, megadave <megadave at gmail.com> wrote:
> iptables is firewalling, not routing
>
> If the same router is doing the NAT for both networks, it should also
> support routing between them, I would think by default.
>
> If you are using both of these on the same physical/logical network
> segment, that is going to be very inefficient - it would make more
> sense to adjust the netmask so that you had one larger "subnet" and
> all systems on the inside would be able to directly address each
> other.
>
> For the specific example you give below, if you are using
> 255.255.255.0 as a netmask, if you adjust the netmask on ALL devices
> to 255.255.248.0 that will give you one subnet with addresses ranging
> from 10.0.0.1 through 10.0.3.254 all directly addressable to each
> other.
>
>
> On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Don Ellis <don.ellis at gmail.com> wrote:
>> We have a network set up with two subnets behind a NAT. We are able to
>> get out of the network from either subnet.
>>
>> What we want to do is be able to connect between a system on one
>> subnet and a system on the other subnet.
>>
>> Does anyone have examples of doing this using iptables?
>>
>> systemA in subnet0: 10.0.1.200
>> systemB in subnet1: 10.0.3.200
>>
>> I have tried making changes in the iptables configuration, but I don't
>> have enough experience in iptables to know where to use -i, -o, -d,
>> and -s (I think those are the values to be adjusted here). Also, I'm
>> making assumptions about what table and chain the rules need to be
>> added to, and when to append (-A) and when to insert (-I).
>>
>> Except for my first adjustment to something someone else had done
>> wrong, my shooting in the dark has had no results.
>>
>> TIA,
>>
>> --Don Ellis
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From lvl at omnitec.net  Wed Jan 16 22:02:54 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:02:54 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:

> Forgot to add, if they are on seperate network segments, then check
> the router that physically interconnects them
>
That's the proxy box where we need the iptables rule.

	Lee

From megadave at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 22:17:21 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:17:21 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>

Well, unless there is some existing iptables rule in place *stopping*
routing between the two networks, it should automatically..

iptables rules would only serve to BLOCK traffic from being forwarded..

Wait, there's one other thing I just thought of, if this is a linux box:

Is /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward set? If not, the box wont do any
direct routing at all.

If that still doesn't help, I'd have to know more about how the
network is setup..


On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 10:02 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:
>
>> Forgot to add, if they are on seperate network segments, then check
>> the router that physically interconnects them
>>
> That's the proxy box where we need the iptables rule.
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From lvl at omnitec.net  Wed Jan 16 22:28:44 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:28:44 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:

> Well, unless there is some existing iptables rule in place *stopping*
> routing between the two networks, it should automatically..
>
It seems like the problem is that the two networks are offnet, as it does
work fine from private -> public.

> Is /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward set? If not, the box wont do any
> direct routing at all.
>
Yep, .. the proxy server does work from 10.0.3 to the outside world, the
problem is that we cannot connect between machines on the bunets.

> If that still doesn't help, I'd have to know more about how the
> network is setup..
>
External router		10.0.1.254
Main server		10.0.1.200
Proxy Server		10.0.1.253
			10.0.3.254
Back Server		10.0.3.200

Need to allow a connection from the Main Server on 1.200 to the Backoffice
server on 3.200, .. which should be possible with an IPTables rule or
pair.

Any pointers or examples would be appreciated.

	Thanks!

	Lee

From mikemol at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 22:34:40 2013
From: mikemol at gmail.com (Michael Mol)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:34:40 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>

On Jan 16, 2013 10:29 PM, "L. V. Lammert" <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:
>
> > Well, unless there is some existing iptables rule in place *stopping*
> > routing between the two networks, it should automatically..
> >
> It seems like the problem is that the two networks are offnet, as it does
> work fine from private -> public.
>
> > Is /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward set? If not, the box wont do any
> > direct routing at all.
> >
> Yep, .. the proxy server does work from 10.0.3 to the outside world, the
> problem is that we cannot connect between machines on the bunets.
>
> > If that still doesn't help, I'd have to know more about how the
> > network is setup..
> >
> External router         10.0.1.254
> Main server             10.0.1.200
> Proxy Server            10.0.1.253
>                         10.0.3.254
> Back Server             10.0.3.200
>
> Need to allow a connection from the Main Server on 1.200 to the Backoffice
> server on 3.200, .. which should be possible with an IPTables rule or
> pair.
>
> Any pointers or examples would be appreciated.
>
>         Thanks!
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

ip route show

>From the router, a source box and a destination box. (For a non-working
case.)
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From lvl at omnitec.net  Wed Jan 16 22:38:39 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:38:39 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:

> ip route show
>
> From the router, a source box and a destination box. (For a non-working
> case.)
>
k$ ip route show
10.0.1.0/24 dev eth0  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.1.253
10.0.3.0/24 dev eth1  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.3.254
default via 10.0.1.254 dev eth0
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From mikemol at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 22:41:35 2013
From: mikemol at gmail.com (Michael Mol)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:41:35 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>

On Jan 16, 2013 10:39 PM, "L. V. Lammert" <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:
>
> > ip route show
> >
> > From the router, a source box and a destination box. (For a non-working
> > case.)
> >
> k$ ip route show
> 10.0.1.0/24 dev eth0  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.1.253
> 10.0.3.0/24 dev eth1  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.3.254
> default via 10.0.1.254 dev eth0
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

And source and dest boxes?
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From lvl at omnitec.net  Wed Jan 16 22:50:23 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 21:50:23 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:

> > k$ ip route show
> > 10.0.1.0/24 dev eth0  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.1.253
> > 10.0.3.0/24 dev eth1  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.3.254
> > default via 10.0.1.254 dev eth0
>
> And source and dest boxes?
>
10.0.1.200 > 10.0.3.200, port 2206

	Thanks!

	Lee
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From mikemol at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 22:53:52 2013
From: mikemol at gmail.com (Michael Mol)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:53:52 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>

On Jan 16, 2013 10:50 PM, "L. V. Lammert" <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:
>
> > > k$ ip route show
> > > 10.0.1.0/24 dev eth0  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.1.253
> > > 10.0.3.0/24 dev eth1  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.3.254
> > > default via 10.0.1.254 dev eth0
> >
> > And source and dest boxes?
> >
> 10.0.1.200 > 10.0.3.200, port 2206
>
>         Thanks!
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

But what are the routes on those two machines?

ION, I'm off to sleep.
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From megadave at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 23:46:19 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 23:46:19 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CAFP7keuhTqN80vqDcibPRoXpZBk-+ehuFKLA25ow9COMTgQgJw@mail.gmail.com>

If you are still sorting this out, what does the routing table on
those two machines (1.200, and 3.200) look like?

And just to humor me, on the proxy server, do:

 cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward


On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 10:50 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:
>
>> > k$ ip route show
>> > 10.0.1.0/24 dev eth0  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.1.253
>> > 10.0.3.0/24 dev eth1  proto kernel  scope link  src 10.0.3.254
>> > default via 10.0.1.254 dev eth0
>>
>> And source and dest boxes?
>>
> 10.0.1.200 > 10.0.3.200, port 2206
>
>         Thanks!
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From don.ellis at gmail.com  Wed Jan 16 23:52:38 2013
From: don.ellis at gmail.com (Don Ellis)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:52:38 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7keuhTqN80vqDcibPRoXpZBk-+ehuFKLA25ow9COMTgQgJw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7keuhTqN80vqDcibPRoXpZBk-+ehuFKLA25ow9COMTgQgJw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CALKyAeujkC+YJW49HVADd0ppBNnyNAP_VaZoi1h2cfgiw80UfA@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 10:46 PM, megadave <megadave at gmail.com> wrote:
> If you are still sorting this out, what does the routing table on
> those two machines (1.200, and 3.200) look like?
>
> And just to humor me, on the proxy server, do:
>
>  cat /proc/sys/net/ipv4/ip_forward

The result is:

1

From lvl at omnitec.net  Wed Jan 16 23:58:04 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 22:58:04 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:

> But what are the routes on those two machines?
>
The two machines have a default route for their respective network, the
10.0.n.254, ..

	Lee
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From megadave at gmail.com  Thu Jan 17 00:03:32 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 00:03:32 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CAFP7keso0q9=dGE-8xtjVhA8oTmWesUDEf+xGgH9C+StJdMkLQ@mail.gmail.com>

Ok, its possible that the problem is that the machine on the .1
network, doesnt have a route to the .3.x network via 1.253, if all it
has is a default route via the router at 1.254.....

You need to add a static route on the 10.0.1.200 machine that says

destination 10.0.3.0, mask 255.255.255.0, gateway 10.0.1.253



On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 11:58 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
> On Wed, 16 Jan 2013, Michael Mol wrote:
>
>> But what are the routes on those two machines?
>>
> The two machines have a default route for their respective network, the
> 10.0.n.254, ..
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From lvl at omnitec.net  Thu Jan 17 00:16:10 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Wed, 16 Jan 2013 23:16:10 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7keso0q9=dGE-8xtjVhA8oTmWesUDEf+xGgH9C+StJdMkLQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7keso0q9=dGE-8xtjVhA8oTmWesUDEf+xGgH9C+StJdMkLQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162314090.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Thu, 17 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:

> Ok, its possible that the problem is that the machine on the .1
> network, doesnt have a route to the .3.x network via 1.253, if all it
> has is a default route via the router at 1.254.....
>
> You need to add a static route on the 10.0.1.200 machine that says
>
> destination 10.0.3.0, mask 255.255.255.0, gateway 10.0.1.253
>
BINGO! Adding routes from each server to the proxy server worked!

One of these days it will make sense, .. in the meantime, THANKS!!

	Lee (& Don)

From megadave at gmail.com  Thu Jan 17 04:36:14 2013
From: megadave at gmail.com (megadave)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 04:36:14 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162314090.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7keso0q9=dGE-8xtjVhA8oTmWesUDEf+xGgH9C+StJdMkLQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162314090.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CAFP7keuk-sOGgDjsOiXB+ocxCoZnrZsKSH+z7ncqfbmmebqA7A@mail.gmail.com>

No problem. "Eats netmasks for breakfast" was once used to describe me

Maybe some night I can actually make it to the LOG meeting I should
host a "IPv4 routing 101" or something.




On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 12:16 AM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
> On Thu, 17 Jan 2013, megadave wrote:
>
>> Ok, its possible that the problem is that the machine on the .1
>> network, doesnt have a route to the .3.x network via 1.253, if all it
>> has is a default route via the router at 1.254.....
>>
>> You need to add a static route on the 10.0.1.200 machine that says
>>
>> destination 10.0.3.0, mask 255.255.255.0, gateway 10.0.1.253
>>
> BINGO! Adding routes from each server to the proxy server worked!
>
> One of these days it will make sense, .. in the meantime, THANKS!!
>
>         Lee (& Don)
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From flanderb at gmail.com  Thu Jan 17 06:36:19 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 06:36:19 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7keuk-sOGgDjsOiXB+ocxCoZnrZsKSH+z7ncqfbmmebqA7A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7keurz8i746kVhaB24EUJZJ90CXUN3CRM7JU5yMtSmsttZA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162102200.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7kesokQxVBj_JR6XjPchfn5hpH0JKXdbxhP51Q=4Qc4SCGQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162118310.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiBZ4dqSCHFUAyNY7yLQY37OOCpkE_8DGqQK0kyniqQQRA@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162138250.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiAbRqBUVm91nvPvBTR4jukv=LxBG3UXXwHg5ZJwr7h88w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162149410.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CA+czFiDYh+sz3UBsJOnUSoYP=6JP0BVQzgGDTaL7WKfdX4gh8w@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162257230.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7keso0q9=dGE-8xtjVhA8oTmWesUDEf+xGgH9C+StJdMkLQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301162314090.14949@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CAFP7keuk-sOGgDjsOiXB+ocxCoZnrZsKSH+z7ncqfbmmebqA7A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJdZESrvYwUNf1JWwjjorCDPUJC1MM=GeYcb4V1tE1g2m3BXbQ@mail.gmail.com>

On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 4:36 AM, megadave <megadave at gmail.com> wrote:

> Maybe some night I can actually make it to the LOG meeting I should
> host a "IPv4 routing 101" or something.
>

I think this is a great idea.

Share and Enjoy
Ben
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From awilliam at whitemice.org  Thu Jan 17 08:15:03 2013
From: awilliam at whitemice.org (Adam Tauno Williams)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 08:15:03 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Routing between subnets with iptables
In-Reply-To: <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CALKyAevVK0AXA7yreVEkETOUvmiKkq6-kFy4tWF2xQQBwUX+yQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAFP7ketd=sfd_SHmqAz5spWUi=-r1dLq3LS_FZ0PcWcBw1kTGg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1358428503.17000.3.camel@localhost>

On Wed, 2013-01-16 at 21:41 -0500, megadave wrote:
> iptables is firewalling, not routing
> If the same router is doing the NAT for both networks, it should also
> support routing between them, I would think by default.

Eh, sort of.  It would certainly route between them by default - if IP
forwarding is enabled.  NAT on the other hand can be configured
4^number-of-networks kind of ways.  NAT makes everything more
complicated.

First question would be: do you need to NAT between the two internal
networks?

> If you are using both of these on the same physical/logical network
> segment, that is going to be very inefficient - it would make more
> sense to adjust the netmask so that you had one larger "subnet" and
> all systems on the inside would be able to directly address each
> other.

Yep

> For the specific example you give below, if you are using
> 255.255.255.0 as a netmask, if you adjust the netmask on ALL devices
> to 255.255.248.0 that will give you one subnet with addresses ranging
> from 10.0.0.1 through 10.0.3.254 all directly addressable to each
> other.
> On Wed, Jan 16, 2013 at 9:29 PM, Don Ellis <don.ellis at gmail.com> wrote:
> > We have a network set up with two subnets behind a NAT. We are able to
> > get out of the network from either subnet.
> > What we want to do is be able to connect between a system on one
> > subnet and a system on the other subnet.
> > Does anyone have examples of doing this using iptables?

My advice is to *STOP* immediately using iptables directly.  The syntax
is very confusing, on top of what can already be confusing by itself.
Is that ... -a  ... or -A ... oh, I can't remember.

Immediately install FWBuilder and let it generate the rules for you.
You can always look at what it generates in order to learn iptables
better.

<http://www.fwbuilder.org/>



-- 
Adam Tauno Williams  GPG D95ED383
Systems Administrator, Python Developer, LPI / NCLA


From casey at grlug.org  Thu Jan 17 16:54:14 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Thu, 17 Jan 2013 16:54:14 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Last night's meeting
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZGvCi+WrZHh=4=-tW=UwRJF2aeD2rWLYUAaMt9YZbfD8Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone,

Thanks again to everyone that helped at last night's GRLUG/GRMakers social.

30 people was much more comfortable than the 50 people we had last week....

Molly brought a crew and did an excellent job on sewing up the curtains
-THANK YOU!!!!!

Oh My Josh got the frame done today and I wanted to share some photo's with
the group:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621857/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8390707864/in/photostream/
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621389/in/photostream/

We have made this into a DUAL Photobooth with touchscreens and camera's on
both sides and the plan for this weekend's Startup Weekend GR will be to
have curtains on one side for the personal photo's and the other side will
be OPEN for GROUP photo's.

There is a little software tweaking we will do tonight to get BOTH systems
running from a single PC.

I was able to get Bret from Standard Computer to lend me a much smaller
printer (so I don't need to drag the MONSTER Printer) to use for this
weekend's event so I'm giving him/them a shout out.

The goal will be to rent this photobooth out and take the $$ to fund our
meetings and other projects so please tell ALL of your friends that it is
available for rent.

We have a 2nd booth in production also.

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From godwin at grandrapids-lug.org  Fri Jan 18 23:13:47 2013
From: godwin at grandrapids-lug.org (Godwin)
Date: Fri, 18 Jan 2013 23:13:47 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Last night's meeting
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZGvCi+WrZHh=4=-tW=UwRJF2aeD2rWLYUAaMt9YZbfD8Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZGvCi+WrZHh=4=-tW=UwRJF2aeD2rWLYUAaMt9YZbfD8Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAO0okVwYr8r8QRCU7mzEHS2ZYWqArC5ExXiYE5Yw8mWog+HKwg@mail.gmail.com>

Aargh!  Is that a ship's captain (in the back)?

http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362857648/in/photostream/

LOL!

On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 4:54 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> Hello everyone,
>
> Thanks again to everyone that helped at last night's GRLUG/GRMakers social.
>
> 30 people was much more comfortable than the 50 people we had last week....
>
> Molly brought a crew and did an excellent job on sewing up the curtains
> -THANK YOU!!!!!
>
> Oh My Josh got the frame done today and I wanted to share some photo's
> with the group:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621857/in/photostream/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8390707864/in/photostream/
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621389/in/photostream/
>
> We have made this into a DUAL Photobooth with touchscreens and camera's on
> both sides and the plan for this weekend's Startup Weekend GR will be to
> have curtains on one side for the personal photo's and the other side will
> be OPEN for GROUP photo's.
>
> There is a little software tweaking we will do tonight to get BOTH systems
> running from a single PC.
>
> I was able to get Bret from Standard Computer to lend me a much smaller
> printer (so I don't need to drag the MONSTER Printer) to use for this
> weekend's event so I'm giving him/them a shout out.
>
> The goal will be to rent this photobooth out and take the $$ to fund our
> meetings and other projects so please tell ALL of your friends that it is
> available for rent.
>
> We have a 2nd booth in production also.
>
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
> casey at grlug.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>



-- 

Ubber::Geek
http://grlug.org/
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From leapole at gmail.com  Sat Jan 19 14:11:10 2013
From: leapole at gmail.com (Josh)
Date: Sat, 19 Jan 2013 14:11:10 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Last night's meeting
In-Reply-To: <CAO0okVwYr8r8QRCU7mzEHS2ZYWqArC5ExXiYE5Yw8mWog+HKwg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZGvCi+WrZHh=4=-tW=UwRJF2aeD2rWLYUAaMt9YZbfD8Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAO0okVwYr8r8QRCU7mzEHS2ZYWqArC5ExXiYE5Yw8mWog+HKwg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CADi8XRsjrAo5tKVNHoYv7yLmk3wedGt2bsDrjzditVvDd2Byrg@mail.gmail.com>

Aye,

The beatings will continue until moral improves!!

On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 11:13 PM, Godwin <godwin at grandrapids-lug.org> wrote:

> Aargh!  Is that a ship's captain (in the back)?
>
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8362857648/in/photostream/
>
> LOL!
>
> On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 4:54 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:
>
>> Hello everyone,
>>
>> Thanks again to everyone that helped at last night's GRLUG/GRMakers
>> social.
>>
>> 30 people was much more comfortable than the 50 people we had last
>> week....
>>
>> Molly brought a crew and did an excellent job on sewing up the curtains
>> -THANK YOU!!!!!
>>
>> Oh My Josh got the frame done today and I wanted to share some photo's
>> with the group:
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621857/in/photostream/
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8390707864/in/photostream/
>> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8389621389/in/photostream/
>>
>> We have made this into a DUAL Photobooth with touchscreens and camera's
>> on both sides and the plan for this weekend's Startup Weekend GR will be to
>> have curtains on one side for the personal photo's and the other side will
>> be OPEN for GROUP photo's.
>>
>> There is a little software tweaking we will do tonight to get BOTH
>> systems running from a single PC.
>>
>> I was able to get Bret from Standard Computer to lend me a much smaller
>> printer (so I don't need to drag the MONSTER Printer) to use for this
>> weekend's event so I'm giving him/them a shout out.
>>
>> The goal will be to rent this photobooth out and take the $$ to fund our
>> meetings and other projects so please tell ALL of your friends that it is
>> available for rent.
>>
>> We have a 2nd booth in production also.
>>
>> Casey DuBois
>> 616-808-6942
>> casey at grlug.org
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
>
> --
>
> Ubber::Geek
> http://grlug.org/
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From casey at grlug.org  Tue Jan 22 14:51:28 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 14:51:28 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Social TOMORROW Wednesday January 23
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZFwybWqkAqtpGOk=DFLfwyP52mPJ80OB8ryJMTKzTyh2Q@mail.gmail.com>

Hello GRLUG and GRMakers!!

THANK YOU to everyone that helped @ Startup Weekend GR, based on our
conversations this weekend there will be several NEW people stopping by
this week's social and I'm going to need everyone to talk and engage these
new people and get them to add themselves to the google group and become a
part of our maker movement.

Here's the details: GRLUG/GRMakers Social, Wednesday January 23rd, 8PM till
whenever @ The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin St.

What are we doing this week:
Open Photo Booth V2 is up and running but can use a little fine tuning so
we will be working on this (including 2nd set of curtains for the other
side).
Raspberry Pi
RepRap 3D printer
Linux Router project
Add 12TB To Storage Network
Hoping to have someone with a Leap Motion developer kit that we can play
with
Hoping to have some people with quad copters

With the parking we had a couple weeks back I've talked with my neighbor
Ottawa Kent insurance and they are happy to let us use their parking lot
for our evening meetings so if you are a regular and have been here before
I'd like to ask you to park @ Ottawa Kent so there will be plenty of
parking for the new people that won't see this email.

I'm thinking Wednesday will be HUGE and encourage everyone to attend and
engage our potential members!

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From casey at grlug.org  Tue Jan 22 16:50:14 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Tue, 22 Jan 2013 16:50:14 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Need your help!
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZE8G8_BzhQuue01_XLSr7eJXyt0eXvsDBKsuAX1bewx6A@mail.gmail.com>

Hey ALL,

We need your help to raise awareness and funds for our friend Joshua Yuhas!

Here is the link to our online fundraising site @ youcaring.com:
http://www.youcaring.com/medical-fundraiser/Joshua-Yuhas-Ankle-Foot-Orthotics-Benefit-Charcot-Marie-Tooth-Disease-/36512

Due to a lack of funds within the Muscular Dystrophy Association they are
no longer funding leg braces for individuals who would benefit from them.
Our challenge is simple, provide Joshua with the braces which would improve
his quality of life!
Joshua is involved in our community, non-profits and his children's school.
Joshua has been a life time "giver" and it is time for us to reciprocate
with great generosity!

*Our major fundraiser will be next Wednesday, January 30 so bring your
entire family!*
* *
Monelli's Italian Grill will donate a portion of ALL FOOD purchases between
5PM and 8PM and this INCLUDES gift certificates or take out orders (tabs
must be closed by 8PM). Monelli's is located at 5675 Byron Center Avenue SW
in Wyoming (Byron Center and M6, by Metro Hospital)

Please share our Facebook event page with your friends:
https://www.facebook.com/events/493043854080257/
Show Monelli's some love by liking them on Facebook:
http://www.facebook.com/MonellisIGSB?fref=ts

Thanks for your time and consideration I look forward to you ALL next week
Wednesday @ Monelli's (Let's pack the house)!!!!

Please contact me with any questions or concerns.

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From casey at grlug.org  Wed Jan 23 15:52:00 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 15:52:00 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] YES there is a GRLUG/GRMakers Social TONIGHT Wednesday
	January 23rd
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZFkW0=2m_YaYNa6SS18JfnYaSAqXf2+8cRFVE6p=8nkog@mail.gmail.com>

Hey All,

YES There will be a GRLUG/GRMakers Social TONIGHT from 8-pm till whenever
and some people are coming as early as 6PM (you are welcome to come
anytime).

With the weather there has been talk of cancelling but I will leave it up
to you if you want to drive/attend or not.

Since we meet weekly and none of our projects NEED help tonight Please do
not risk anything to come but if you are up to it some of us will be there.

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From chrischocko at gmail.com  Wed Jan 23 17:00:06 2013
From: chrischocko at gmail.com (Chris Chocko)
Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:00:06 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] grlug tonight
Message-ID: <CAGHRSvEXowv86pCd0-6sTBJZpek94OGFDN6K8U3TaTw29QGNmw@mail.gmail.com>

Anyone heading to GRLUG with room for another? I'm looking for a ride to
the get together tonight. I live by Leonard and Plainfield and can meet
downtown if need be.

Send me a text if you can, my voicebox is full - Chris (616) 283 8102
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From mikemol at gmail.com  Wed Jan 23 17:13:12 2013
From: mikemol at gmail.com (Michael Mol)
Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:13:12 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] grlug tonight
In-Reply-To: <CAGHRSvEXowv86pCd0-6sTBJZpek94OGFDN6K8U3TaTw29QGNmw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGHRSvEXowv86pCd0-6sTBJZpek94OGFDN6K8U3TaTw29QGNmw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CA+czFiByOwfOByKJXdzU0NA1nN-2yHNMVXizjfUc_RpeCy4fqw@mail.gmail.com>

On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 5:00 PM, Chris Chocko <chrischocko at gmail.com> wrote:
> Anyone heading to GRLUG with room for another? I'm looking for a ride to the
> get together tonight. I live by Leonard and Plainfield and can meet downtown
> if need be.
>
> Send me a text if you can, my voicebox is full - Chris (616) 283 8102

Sure. I'm at Leonard & Diamond.

--
:wq

From slestak989 at gmail.com  Wed Jan 23 17:36:51 2013
From: slestak989 at gmail.com (Steve Romanow)
Date: Wed, 23 Jan 2013 17:36:51 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] grlug tonight
In-Reply-To: <CA+czFiByOwfOByKJXdzU0NA1nN-2yHNMVXizjfUc_RpeCy4fqw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAGHRSvEXowv86pCd0-6sTBJZpek94OGFDN6K8U3TaTw29QGNmw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CA+czFiByOwfOByKJXdzU0NA1nN-2yHNMVXizjfUc_RpeCy4fqw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAAuMJGFgq_ZqATL810MWbVfw0uzFHH_TuiyEv+b910YUU=Zq9g@mail.gmail.com>

I am not going to be there tonight guys.  Short on gas to cross town, will
go out and get a cup o' joe with Ed but stay in Kentwood.


On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 5:13 PM, Michael Mol <mikemol at gmail.com> wrote:

> On Wed, Jan 23, 2013 at 5:00 PM, Chris Chocko <chrischocko at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> > Anyone heading to GRLUG with room for another? I'm looking for a ride to
> the
> > get together tonight. I live by Leonard and Plainfield and can meet
> downtown
> > if need be.
> >
> > Send me a text if you can, my voicebox is full - Chris (616) 283 8102
>
> Sure. I'm at Leonard & Diamond.
>
> --
> :wq
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From steveg at branchadventures.org  Thu Jan 24 17:45:33 2013
From: steveg at branchadventures.org (Steve @ HCS)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 17:45:33 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] PFSense boxes
Message-ID: <5101B98D.5050009@branchadventures.org>

I don't know how many of you have used PFSense, but i have found the 
software to be excellent.  Have any of you ever compared m0n0wall vs 
Untangle vs PFSense?  My initial research found Untangle licensing 
expensive, and i never really looked at monowall.   ???

http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/firewall_computers is where i have 
been purchasing them from lately for business, and haven't had any 
issues (other than some IPSEC troubles due to lack of experience).

Also i wondered if OpenVPN can be used in a bridge configuration?
-- 


      Healthy Computer Systems


        Steve Grody - Owner


        616-502-2454

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From flanderb at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 18:22:11 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 18:22:11 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
Message-ID: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>

Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible to
have two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading our
companies internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite slow and
expensive.   I'd like to look at some of the cheaper options, like a
Comcast Business Line.  The issue with that is that it doesn't have an SLA.
 It would be awesome to be able to have the cheap fast line with the T1 as
a backup.  That way we can dramatically increase the speed but still have
the solid line with the SLA as a backup.

I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work for
stuff originating in house but not stuff originating outside.  Is it
possible to combine two disparate lines so that even requests coming in
will failover to the backup if the main line is down?



Share and Enjoy
Ben
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From jefrat72 at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 18:28:37 2013
From: jefrat72 at gmail.com (Joel Freiberg)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 18:28:37 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CABv3XAwPj_Y+9m7uJGqnrrr5u=b8VBphxVpGuNY1bVKhvtH1cw@mail.gmail.com>

Few products come to mind....

Cisco just came out with a new small business firewall, the ISA500
series.  Licensing is much simpler, they seem to be a much better
product than the SA series, will see soon as we're starting to install
them.

Or go with PFSense, just put on a server and have a couple of NICs.
I'm pretty sure Astaro does it as well, haven't had much experience
with them though.



On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 6:22 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com> wrote:
> Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible to have
> two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading our companies
> internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite slow and expensive.
> I'd like to look at some of the cheaper options, like a Comcast Business
> Line.  The issue with that is that it doesn't have an SLA.  It would be
> awesome to be able to have the cheap fast line with the T1 as a backup.
> That way we can dramatically increase the speed but still have the solid
> line with the SLA as a backup.
>
> I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work for
> stuff originating in house but not stuff originating outside.  Is it
> possible to combine two disparate lines so that even requests coming in will
> failover to the backup if the main line is down?
>
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

From lvl at omnitec.net  Thu Jan 24 18:32:52 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 17:32:52 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.g
 mail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201301242331.r0ONVkiE000848@Mail>

At 05:22 PM 1/24/2013, Benjamin Flanders wrote:
>Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible 
>to have two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading 
>our companies internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite 
>slow and expensive.   I'd like to look at some of the cheaper 
>options, like a Comcast Business Line.  The issue with that is that 
>it doesn't have an SLA.  It would be awesome to be able to have the 
>cheap fast line with the T1 as a backup.  That way we can 
>dramatically increase the speed but still have the solid line with 
>the SLA as a backup.
>
>I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work 
>for stuff originating in house but not stuff originating 
>outside.  Is it possible to combine two disparate lines so that even 
>requests coming in will failover to the backup if the main line is down?

The simple answer is no, .. except in the case of outbound access 
only. In that case, you can switch from one to the other, or setup a 
router with both connections and setup some firewall rules to decide 
which connection to use by IP.

For *incoming* connections (i.e. to a public server), you would have 
to advertise your own BGP, which is both expensive and complex.

If you have a T1 now, the better solution would be to get a quote on 
bonded T1s (two, or even three) from your provider. You would have an 
SLA, and most enterprise routers will support bonded T1s (even the 
lowly Cisco 1725, which we have).

         Lee 


From lvl at omnitec.net  Thu Jan 24 18:32:52 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 17:32:52 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.g
 mail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <201301242331.r0ONVkiE000848@Mail>

At 05:22 PM 1/24/2013, Benjamin Flanders wrote:
>Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible 
>to have two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading 
>our companies internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite 
>slow and expensive.   I'd like to look at some of the cheaper 
>options, like a Comcast Business Line.  The issue with that is that 
>it doesn't have an SLA.  It would be awesome to be able to have the 
>cheap fast line with the T1 as a backup.  That way we can 
>dramatically increase the speed but still have the solid line with 
>the SLA as a backup.
>
>I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work 
>for stuff originating in house but not stuff originating 
>outside.  Is it possible to combine two disparate lines so that even 
>requests coming in will failover to the backup if the main line is down?

The simple answer is no, .. except in the case of outbound access 
only. In that case, you can switch from one to the other, or setup a 
router with both connections and setup some firewall rules to decide 
which connection to use by IP.

For *incoming* connections (i.e. to a public server), you would have 
to advertise your own BGP, which is both expensive and complex.

If you have a T1 now, the better solution would be to get a quote on 
bonded T1s (two, or even three) from your provider. You would have an 
SLA, and most enterprise routers will support bonded T1s (even the 
lowly Cisco 1725, which we have).

         Lee 


From richardnienhuis at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 19:04:33 2013
From: richardnienhuis at gmail.com (Richard Nienhuis)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:04:33 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJd2Bx_tsF43zEoNYi3cQ2mxBxrf5zBFarB8xVRJn5bJJ3fX_A@mail.gmail.com>

Much of it depends on what you need. Its probably going to be hackey for
incoming connections.  The normal way would be to get an AS number and have
your ISPs transit bgp.  Otherwise I'd use the comcast to reduce the load on
the T1.  Basically you are going to need to pick one wan or the other for
incoming.




On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 6:22 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible to
> have two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading our
> companies internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite slow and
> expensive.   I'd like to look at some of the cheaper options, like a
> Comcast Business Line.  The issue with that is that it doesn't have an SLA.
>  It would be awesome to be able to have the cheap fast line with the T1 as
> a backup.  That way we can dramatically increase the speed but still have
> the solid line with the SLA as a backup.
>
> I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work for
> stuff originating in house but not stuff originating outside.  Is it
> possible to combine two disparate lines so that even requests coming in
> will failover to the backup if the main line is down?
>
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From richardnienhuis at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 19:04:33 2013
From: richardnienhuis at gmail.com (Richard Nienhuis)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:04:33 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJd2Bx_tsF43zEoNYi3cQ2mxBxrf5zBFarB8xVRJn5bJJ3fX_A@mail.gmail.com>

Much of it depends on what you need. Its probably going to be hackey for
incoming connections.  The normal way would be to get an AS number and have
your ISPs transit bgp.  Otherwise I'd use the comcast to reduce the load on
the T1.  Basically you are going to need to pick one wan or the other for
incoming.




On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 6:22 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> Not looking to take up too much of anyone's time, but is it possible to
> have two internet connections combined?  I'm looking at upgrading our
> companies internet.  Currently we have a single T1 line.  Quite slow and
> expensive.   I'd like to look at some of the cheaper options, like a
> Comcast Business Line.  The issue with that is that it doesn't have an SLA.
>  It would be awesome to be able to have the cheap fast line with the T1 as
> a backup.  That way we can dramatically increase the speed but still have
> the solid line with the SLA as a backup.
>
> I have googled and found out about dual wan routers, this would work for
> stuff originating in house but not stuff originating outside.  Is it
> possible to combine two disparate lines so that even requests coming in
> will failover to the backup if the main line is down?
>
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From leapole at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 19:12:59 2013
From: leapole at gmail.com (Josh)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 19:12:59 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] PFSense boxes
In-Reply-To: <5101B98D.5050009@branchadventures.org>
References: <5101B98D.5050009@branchadventures.org>
Message-ID: <CADi8XRtwmb2CM=_3Ct9X0yZdwcMW+QQkchBqfQqObVntz9Qn0Q@mail.gmail.com>

i think monowall development has stopped or is moving slow,  Untangled is
nice but requires a licensing and buying for some features.

I have ran a pfsense box for a while and picked that out of the 3 and
would recommend it to anyone that wants to use it

On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 5:45 PM, Steve @ HCS <steveg at branchadventures.org>wrote:

>  I don't know how many of you have used PFSense, but i have found the
> software to be excellent.  Have any of you ever compared m0n0wall vs
> Untangle vs PFSense?  My initial research found Untangle licensing
> expensive, and i never really looked at monowall.   ???
>
> http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/firewall_computers is where i have
> been purchasing them from lately for business, and haven't had any issues
> (other than some IPSEC troubles due to lack of experience).
>
> Also i wondered if OpenVPN can be used in a bridge configuration?
> --
>  Healthy Computer Systems Steve Grody - Owner 616-502-2454
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From lvl at omnitec.net  Thu Jan 24 19:16:52 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 18:16:52 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Rookie Network Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJd2Bx_tsF43zEoNYi3cQ2mxBxrf5zBFarB8xVRJn5bJJ3fX_A@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESoMJuz5S723ec_MnMfLNo285SSrdfHxJk79Nz9Rgr=4aQ@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJd2Bx_tsF43zEoNYi3cQ2mxBxrf5zBFarB8xVRJn5bJJ3fX_A@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301241815140.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Thu, 24 Jan 2013, Richard Nienhuis wrote:

> Much of it depends on what you need. Its probably going to be hackey for
> incoming connections.  The normal way would be to get an AS number and have
> your ISPs transit bgp.  Otherwise I'd use the comcast to reduce the load on
> the T1.  Basically you are going to need to pick one wan or the other for
> incoming.
>
If you don't want to go with mutlipe T1s, another solution would be to use
Comcast for *all* outbound traffic (set that router as your default route
outbound), and keep the T1 for your DMZ with incoming traffic to your
servers.

	Lee

From pilcheck at gmail.com  Thu Jan 24 20:35:49 2013
From: pilcheck at gmail.com (Dan Pilcheck)
Date: Thu, 24 Jan 2013 20:35:49 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] PFSense boxes
In-Reply-To: <CADi8XRtwmb2CM=_3Ct9X0yZdwcMW+QQkchBqfQqObVntz9Qn0Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <5101B98D.5050009@branchadventures.org>
 <CADi8XRtwmb2CM=_3Ct9X0yZdwcMW+QQkchBqfQqObVntz9Qn0Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAN2Qd3rv_giaZZ3Gp9k6-KdfqOpzHF7=i=4hBW_EVtnDFSDXhg@mail.gmail.com>

We've run pfSense at our warehouse for about a year now.
It's been reliable and is pretty straight forward.
A handful of people, voip phones and a T1.

At our office Untangle has been our proxy for nearly four years.
It does require a little more horsepower but has been very reliable as well.
In fact, recently(~6 mo) we put it in router mode. http://imgur.com/n84PFip
(We also moved from 1 subnet to many VLANs, Procurve handles internal
routes; we simplified our setup by removing an 1841 that only routed/NAT'd.)

We've only ever used Untangle's free features. Boss likes the report's
pie charts.
Its our first line of filtering, firewalling and monitoring -now with
routing as well.
Office handles about 50 people, phones. 10 meg fiber.

OpenVPN can not* run in bridged mode on either product.
We successfully run VPNs on both of the aforementioned products daily.

I don't have any experience with m0n0wall, IIRC I got the same feeling as Josh.

*Well, anything is possible if you're dedicated.

On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 7:12 PM, Josh <leapole at gmail.com> wrote:
> i think monowall development has stopped or is moving slow,  Untangled is
> nice but requires a licensing and buying for some features.
>
> I have ran a pfsense box for a while and picked that out of the 3 and would
> recommend it to anyone that wants to use it
>
> On Thu, Jan 24, 2013 at 5:45 PM, Steve @ HCS <steveg at branchadventures.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> I don't know how many of you have used PFSense, but i have found the
>> software to be excellent.  Have any of you ever compared m0n0wall vs
>> Untangle vs PFSense?  My initial research found Untangle licensing
>> expensive, and i never really looked at monowall.   ???
>>
>> http://www.logicsupply.com/categories/firewall_computers is where i have
>> been purchasing them from lately for business, and haven't had any issues
>> (other than some IPSEC troubles due to lack of experience).
>>
>> Also i wondered if OpenVPN can be used in a bridge configuration?
>> --

From casey at grlug.org  Fri Jan 25 17:25:37 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2013 17:25:37 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Printing 3D @ The Warehouse TONIGHT
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZGua0GP1OWhtM9TaD_stxNZd=y-=XoUWaKrU0Ok-571Bg@mail.gmail.com>

Hey All,

Josh and I have unpacked the Makerbot Replicator 2 and are printing @ The
Warehouse if anyone wants to come by to see it.

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From casey at grlug.org  Fri Jan 25 19:03:42 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Fri, 25 Jan 2013 19:03:42 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Printing 3D @ The Warehouse TONIGHT
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZGua0GP1OWhtM9TaD_stxNZd=y-=XoUWaKrU0Ok-571Bg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZGua0GP1OWhtM9TaD_stxNZd=y-=XoUWaKrU0Ok-571Bg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZEhTOtabxyFha39Bem-9vCce3749Sq7m7mOjdRdChGQzw@mail.gmail.com>

What color should we use??:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414423027/in/photostream

We've printed a new iPhone case for me:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414517761/in/photostream

Anyone need something printed?



On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 5:25 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> Hey All,
>
> Josh and I have unpacked the Makerbot Replicator 2 and are printing @ The
> Warehouse if anyone wants to come by to see it.
>
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
> casey at grlug.org
>



-- 
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From zetaphor at gmail.com  Sat Jan 26 01:56:08 2013
From: zetaphor at gmail.com (Gary Daigle)
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2013 01:56:08 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Hello!
Message-ID: <CAE+iJU7=iieVJ+9dno2MpQAM5XXx+eKLHBODKXqJ0zvStnGNRA@mail.gmail.com>

Hello everyone!

Never sure where to start with introductions. My name is Gary, my handle is
Zetaphor. A few days ago I learned that this group exists, and I'm
interested in learning more.

I've been using Linux for about two years now on both my desktop and my
Marvell Dreamplug. I'm a developer by profession and a tinkerer at heart.

I've never participated in any kind of Linux related group outside of
Reddit.
For those of you who are Redditors, check out my subreddit:
http://www.reddit.com/r/linuxprojects/

I consider myself to be of intermediate skill level with Linux Currently
using Debian Squeezze, building an Arch environment in a VM, reading as
much as I can about doing LFS). My ultimate goals are to learn as much as I
can about the architecture and maintenance of a Linux system for my
personal use and to satisfy my endless curiosity.

I'm interested in learning more about this group and possibly
participating, do I simply show up to one of the meetings? What kinds of
things do you guys do?

On an unrelated note, I'm also an ex-smoker and current vaper (user of
electronic cigarettes). I tinker with and modify my devices and make my own
juices. So if there are any smokers or vapers in this group, I'd love to
sit and have a chat.
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From kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com  Sat Jan 26 02:01:26 2013
From: kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com (Kelly Vanderwell)
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2013 02:01:26 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Hello!
In-Reply-To: <CAE+iJU7=iieVJ+9dno2MpQAM5XXx+eKLHBODKXqJ0zvStnGNRA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE+iJU7=iieVJ+9dno2MpQAM5XXx+eKLHBODKXqJ0zvStnGNRA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <51037F46.4010407@gmail.com>

Just come to a meeting!  Every wednesday from 8p-whenever at the 
warehouse, 112 baldwin, Jenison MI.

And we've had vapers come through.  Have you been to mr. e liquid on 
division?

Kelly

On 01/26/2013 01:56 AM, Gary Daigle wrote:
> Hello everyone!
>
> Never sure where to start with introductions. My name is Gary, my 
> handle is Zetaphor. A few days ago I learned that this group exists, 
> and I'm interested in learning more.
>
> I've been using Linux for about two years now on both my desktop and 
> my Marvell Dreamplug. I'm a developer by profession and a tinkerer at 
> heart.
>
> I've never participated in any kind of Linux related group outside of 
> Reddit.
> For those of you who are Redditors, check out my subreddit:
> http://www.reddit.com/r/linuxprojects/
>
> I consider myself to be of intermediate skill level with Linux 
> Currently using Debian Squeezze, building an Arch environment in a VM, 
> reading as much as I can about doing LFS). My ultimate goals are to 
> learn as much as I can about the architecture and maintenance of a 
> Linux system for my personal use and to satisfy my endless curiosity.
>
> I'm interested in learning more about this group and possibly 
> participating, do I simply show up to one of the meetings? What kinds 
> of things do you guys do?
>
> On an unrelated note, I'm also an ex-smoker and current vaper (user of 
> electronic cigarettes). I tinker with and modify my devices and make 
> my own juices. So if there are any smokers or vapers in this group, 
> I'd love to sit and have a chat.
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

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From cprossu at gmail.com  Sat Jan 26 02:04:43 2013
From: cprossu at gmail.com (Cprossu)
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2013 00:04:43 -0700
Subject: [GRLUG] Printing 3D @ The Warehouse TONIGHT
In-Reply-To: <CAH4FDZEhTOtabxyFha39Bem-9vCce3749Sq7m7mOjdRdChGQzw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZGua0GP1OWhtM9TaD_stxNZd=y-=XoUWaKrU0Ok-571Bg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH4FDZEhTOtabxyFha39Bem-9vCce3749Sq7m7mOjdRdChGQzw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAD0nuMX3Y6fx_V2yTRX3_X6+g4cDPbRAh3FGhsWj63_hJtp7ww@mail.gmail.com>

looking good Casey, glad to see you got that up and running. That iphone
case will be a good conversation piece too

On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 5:03 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:

> What color should we use??:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414423027/in/photostream
>
> We've printed a new iPhone case for me:
> http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414517761/in/photostream
>
> Anyone need something printed?
>
>
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 5:25 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org> wrote:
>
>> Hey All,
>>
>> Josh and I have unpacked the Makerbot Replicator 2 and are printing @ The
>> Warehouse if anyone wants to come by to see it.
>>
>> Casey DuBois
>> 616-808-6942
>> casey at grlug.org
>>
>
>
>
> --
> Casey DuBois
> 616-808-6942
> casey at grlug.org
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com  Sat Jan 26 02:07:01 2013
From: kelly.vanderwell at gmail.com (Kelly Vanderwell)
Date: Sat, 26 Jan 2013 02:07:01 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Printing 3D @ The Warehouse TONIGHT
In-Reply-To: <CAD0nuMX3Y6fx_V2yTRX3_X6+g4cDPbRAh3FGhsWj63_hJtp7ww@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAH4FDZGua0GP1OWhtM9TaD_stxNZd=y-=XoUWaKrU0Ok-571Bg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAH4FDZEhTOtabxyFha39Bem-9vCce3749Sq7m7mOjdRdChGQzw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAD0nuMX3Y6fx_V2yTRX3_X6+g4cDPbRAh3FGhsWj63_hJtp7ww@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <51038095.1080401@gmail.com>

its bright yellow and he said he wants people to ask about it.  hi cpro.

On 01/26/2013 02:04 AM, Cprossu wrote:
> looking good Casey, glad to see you got that up and running. That 
> iphone case will be a good conversation piece too
>
> On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 5:03 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org 
> <mailto:casey at grlug.org>> wrote:
>
>     What color should we use??:
>     http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414423027/in/photostream
>
>     We've printed a new iPhone case for me:
>     http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/8414517761/in/photostream
>
>     Anyone need something printed?
>
>
>
>     On Fri, Jan 25, 2013 at 5:25 PM, Casey DuBois <casey at grlug.org
>     <mailto:casey at grlug.org>> wrote:
>
>         Hey All,
>
>         Josh and I have unpacked the Makerbot Replicator 2 and are
>         printing @ The Warehouse if anyone wants to come by to see it.
>         Casey DuBois
>         616-808-6942 <tel:616-808-6942>
>         casey at grlug.org <mailto:casey at grlug.org>
>
>
>
>
>     -- 
>     Casey DuBois
>     616-808-6942 <tel:616-808-6942>
>     casey at grlug.org <mailto:casey at grlug.org>
>
>     _______________________________________________
>     grlug mailing list
>     grlug at grlug.org <mailto:grlug at grlug.org>
>     http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug

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From awilliam at whitemice.org  Sun Jan 27 11:38:36 2013
From: awilliam at whitemice.org (Adam Tauno Williams)
Date: Sun, 27 Jan 2013 11:38:36 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Hello!
In-Reply-To: <CAE+iJU7=iieVJ+9dno2MpQAM5XXx+eKLHBODKXqJ0zvStnGNRA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAE+iJU7=iieVJ+9dno2MpQAM5XXx+eKLHBODKXqJ0zvStnGNRA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <1359304716.8308.11.camel@localhost>

On Sat, 2013-01-26 at 01:56 -0500, Gary Daigle wrote:
> Hello everyone!

Yo!  And welcome.

> Never sure where to start with introductions. My name is Gary, my
> handle is Zetaphor. A few days ago I learned that this group exists,
> and I'm interested in learning more.
> I've been using Linux for about two years now on both my desktop and
> my Marvell Dreamplug. I'm a developer by profession and a tinkerer at
> heart.

You should fit right in.

> I consider myself to be of intermediate skill level with Linux

Same here.

>  Currently using Debian Squeezze, building an Arch environment in a
> VM, reading as much as I can about doing LFS). My ultimate goals are
> to learn as much as I can about the architecture and maintenance of a
> Linux system for my personal use and to satisfy my endless curiosity.
> I'm interested in learning more about this group and possibly
> participating, do I simply show up to one of the meetings? What kinds
> of things do you guys do?

Just show up.  GRLUG is very much entangled with GR Makers, GR Python
Users Group, and other user groups.  The scope of interests is very
wind.  And if you have any questions about something Open Sourcey feel
free to post it to this list - I'm certain someone will be opinionated
about it.

-- 
Adam Tauno Williams  GPG D95ED383
Systems Administrator, Python Developer, LPI / NCLA


From brousch at gmail.com  Mon Jan 28 11:35:38 2013
From: brousch at gmail.com (Ben Rousch)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 11:35:38 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Open Source at tonight's GRWebDev
Message-ID: <CAOPHfB13Qkfv_cvr49wsZBgKNmGqdFbznV0b5+n8MvHsX+FHFQ@mail.gmail.com>

Some of you may be interested in tonight's GRWebDev meeting. We'll be
talking about open source licensing, philosophy, and law. More
information is at http://www.meetup.com/grwebdev/events/44262322/

-- 
 Ben Rousch
   brousch at gmail.com
   http://clusterbleep.net/

From casey at grlug.org  Mon Jan 28 15:55:18 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Mon, 28 Jan 2013 15:55:18 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Social This Wednesday Jan 30th
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZH_uHgtD+SaKRTf=6Y5k=iv5J6u30-A=QES4Xp_xnYy2w@mail.gmail.com>

Hello GRLUG and GRMakers!

GRLUG/GRMakers Social Wednesday January 30th @ The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin
St., Jenison from 8-PM till whenever.
(Corner of River and Baldwin (south side) Look for the Sailor Man carving)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/7337538118/in/photostream
>From Grand Rapids I-196W to exit 69C Baldwin St. exit, Left River (2nd
St.).
>From Holland I-196E to exit 69, Left on Chicago Dr., Right on Main St.,
Right on Baldwin, Right on River.
** Parking also available @ Ottawa Kent Insurance off Main St.**

If you are not registered for the GRMakers Google group yet please visit:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers<http://www.linkedin.com/redirect?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups%2Egoogle%2Ecom%2Fforum%2F%3Ffromgroups%23%21forum%2Fgrmakers&urlhash=dSX1&_t=mbox_mebc>


Here's some pictures from recent GRLUG/GRMakers Social's:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/sets/72157632599546408/

At this week's Social we will be working on fine tuning the Photobooth V2
along with finishing assembly of our RepRap Open Source 3D printer.
We will also be demonstrating the MakerBot Replicator 2 that arrived on
Friday.

I would like to ask your participation in the Fundraiser Dinner for Josh
before this week's social from 5-8PM @ Monelli's, please bring the entire
family!
* *
Monelli's Italian Grill will donate a portion of ALL FOOD purchases between
5PM and 8PM and this INCLUDES gift certificates or take out orders (tabs
must be closed by 8PM). Monelli's is located at 5675 Byron Center Avenue SW
in Wyoming (Byron Center and M6, by Metro Hospital)

Share the Facebook event page with your friends: *
http://www.facebook.com/events/493043854080257/*

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From flanderb at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 16:25:20 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:25:20 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
Message-ID: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>

How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.

I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
treat, but some sites time out as well.

ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out lines
every 5-10 minutes without timing out.

Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
thoughts.

Share and Enjoy
Ben
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From richardnienhuis at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 16:31:58 2013
From: richardnienhuis at gmail.com (Richard Nienhuis)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:31:58 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJd2Bx-ahym4QW_z=Ywa6P078vv6ho2VtwgUvX6DkuGQN2wkoQ@mail.gmail.com>

You could use http://oss.oetiker.ch/smokeping/ to visualize a long stretch
of pings to a known stable ip.


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
> very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
> full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
> relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
> an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.
>
> I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
> treat, but some sites time out as well.
>
> ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out lines
> every 5-10 minutes without timing out.
>
> Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
> see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
> thoughts.
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From richardnienhuis at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 16:31:58 2013
From: richardnienhuis at gmail.com (Richard Nienhuis)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:31:58 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJd2Bx-ahym4QW_z=Ywa6P078vv6ho2VtwgUvX6DkuGQN2wkoQ@mail.gmail.com>

You could use http://oss.oetiker.ch/smokeping/ to visualize a long stretch
of pings to a known stable ip.


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
> very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
> full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
> relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
> an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.
>
> I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
> treat, but some sites time out as well.
>
> ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out lines
> every 5-10 minutes without timing out.
>
> Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
> see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
> thoughts.
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From jdburnz at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 16:31:54 2013
From: jdburnz at gmail.com (Joshua Burns)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:31:54 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>

Man, this sounds like a nightmare. If you do find something I'd be very
interested in hearing about it-- Might test my internet connectivity using
the same method. Also laggy / randomly timing out. I live in Standale and
have Comcast, you around that same area with the same service by any chance?



On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
> very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
> full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
> relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
> an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.
>
> I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
> treat, but some sites time out as well.
>
> ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out lines
> every 5-10 minutes without timing out.
>
> Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
> see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
> thoughts.
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From flanderb at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 16:42:28 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:42:28 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>

I have Comast at home in Jenison but I am by the GR airport at work right
now.  I e-mailed my wife and she hasn't noticed anything wrong with the
internet, but this might be because her use is mostly Pintrest and
Facebook, with a spattering of Etsy thrown in.  I haven't asked her about
Netflix which the kids love and have probably watched today, but I think
she would have mentioned that.



Share and Enjoy
Ben


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Joshua Burns <jdburnz at gmail.com> wrote:

> Man, this sounds like a nightmare. If you do find something I'd be very
> interested in hearing about it-- Might test my internet connectivity using
> the same method. Also laggy / randomly timing out. I live in Standale and
> have Comcast, you around that same area with the same service by any chance?
>
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
>> very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
>> full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
>> relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
>> an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.
>>
>> I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
>> treat, but some sites time out as well.
>>
>> ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out lines
>> every 5-10 minutes without timing out.
>>
>> Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
>> see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
>> thoughts.
>>
>> Share and Enjoy
>> Ben
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From ben.demott at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 17:35:31 2013
From: ben.demott at gmail.com (Ben DeMott)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:35:31 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>

Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all it
was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained data
transer.


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:42 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> I have Comast at home in Jenison but I am by the GR airport at work right
> now.  I e-mailed my wife and she hasn't noticed anything wrong with the
> internet, but this might be because her use is mostly Pintrest and
> Facebook, with a spattering of Etsy thrown in.  I haven't asked her about
> Netflix which the kids love and have probably watched today, but I think
> she would have mentioned that.
>
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:31 PM, Joshua Burns <jdburnz at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> Man, this sounds like a nightmare. If you do find something I'd be very
>> interested in hearing about it-- Might test my internet connectivity using
>> the same method. Also laggy / randomly timing out. I live in Standale and
>> have Comcast, you around that same area with the same service by any chance?
>>
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 4:25 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:
>>
>>> How can I diagnose internet quality Issues?  Currently I am having
>>> very weird issues with my internet.  Speed tests show acceptable ping and
>>> full download and upload speed, but connecting to a long running(
>>> relatively) service like ssh into my server at home, updating gems, playing
>>> an online game, gmail spell-check, time out, most of the time.
>>>
>>> I can e-mail, even emailing 500kb files, no problem.  Googling works a
>>> treat, but some sites time out as well.
>>>
>>> ssh is spotty if it doesn't time out.  Netstat is still pumping out
>>> lines every 5-10 minutes without timing out.
>>>
>>> Any ideas on what is up?  I am on wireless, I could connect the cat5 and
>>> see if this helps, in fact I'll do that but I'd like to hear some more
>>> thoughts.
>>>
>>> Share and Enjoy
>>> Ben
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From lvl at omnitec.net  Tue Jan 29 17:36:40 2013
From: lvl at omnitec.net (L. V. Lammert)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 16:36:40 -0600 (CST)
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>

On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:

> Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
> there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all it
> was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
> typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained data
> transer.
>
Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??

	Lee

From ben.demott at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 17:43:24 2013
From: ben.demott at gmail.com (Ben DeMott)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:43:24 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>

I guess the only difference is it isn't afforded the niceties of TCP or UDP
- in my experience it seems to be less fault tolerant when sending larger
packets. Also, I'm sorry I mis-spoke.  The maximum packet-size for the body
of an ICMP-Echo request is 65507 bytes.
I don't really have any documentation to back this up, but it has been my
personal experience that when you have weird cable/driver/card issues ICMP
with large packets usually breaks.


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>
> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all it
> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained
> data
> > transer.
> >
> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From flanderb at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 17:46:07 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:46:07 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>

Weird it must have been something with our internet provider.  It just
cleared up.


Share and Enjoy
Ben


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:43 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:

> I guess the only difference is it isn't afforded the niceties of TCP or
> UDP - in my experience it seems to be less fault tolerant when sending
> larger packets. Also, I'm sorry I mis-spoke.  The maximum packet-size for
> the body of an ICMP-Echo request is 65507 bytes.
> I don't really have any documentation to back this up, but it has been my
> personal experience that when you have weird cable/driver/card issues ICMP
> with large packets usually breaks.
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>
>> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>>
>> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
>> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all it
>> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
>> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained
>> data
>> > transer.
>> >
>> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>>
>>         Lee
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From flanderb at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 17:46:18 2013
From: flanderb at gmail.com (Benjamin Flanders)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 17:46:18 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAJdZESqYqZdkbrVaT9avwVxrs8VE-n_7wrDNs4fjrSXFhWWXNA@mail.gmail.com>

Thanks for the suggestions


Share and Enjoy
Ben


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> Weird it must have been something with our internet provider.  It just
> cleared up.
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:43 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I guess the only difference is it isn't afforded the niceties of TCP or
>> UDP - in my experience it seems to be less fault tolerant when sending
>> larger packets. Also, I'm sorry I mis-spoke.  The maximum packet-size for
>> the body of an ICMP-Echo request is 65507 bytes.
>> I don't really have any documentation to back this up, but it has been my
>> personal experience that when you have weird cable/driver/card issues ICMP
>> with large packets usually breaks.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>>>
>>> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
>>> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all
>>> it
>>> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
>>> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained
>>> data
>>> > transer.
>>> >
>>> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>>>
>>>         Lee
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
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From bob.kline at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 18:52:44 2013
From: bob.kline at gmail.com (Bob Kline)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 18:52:44 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
Message-ID: <CAFOq4EJet8reaBoowVgbJ4NYw5Ynz_xnp6DjBQS3SwcQUC9CDQ@mail.gmail.com>

I use this,  speakeasy.net/speedtest, and
Comcast's own,  http://speedtest.comcast.net/,
to see if there's any consistency between the
three.  I mostly use the Washington, DC, test
point.

Last weekend my service, Comcast, was
weird.  I was getting very low speed results,
relative to nominal.  It's back to "normal" now,
but the episode did last much of the weekend.

I was getting a few megabits down, which
is a small fraction of what I was paying for.

Don't even thing of using different test
points for your tests, because those vary
widely too.

For what it's wroth, Comcast has test
locations in at least Chicago, Detroit,
and DC.  You'd expect those would be
kept running well, if only for advertising
purposes.  But over the weekend the
results were crummy, so something was
indeed going on in my experience.

   -- Bob


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:

> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>
> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all it
> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained
> data
> > transer.
> >
> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>
>         Lee
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From bob.kline at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 18:54:50 2013
From: bob.kline at gmail.com (Bob Kline)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 18:54:50 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFOq4EKnDchMCwMKuhw5p5L9r=sTBZ=hVz_Bs0LJWZO9F64F0Q@mail.gmail.com>

We have Comcast too, in GR.  This morning
it just dropped out.  Not for long as it turns
out, but it just went dead for some minutes.

   -- Bob


On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> Weird it must have been something with our internet provider.  It just
> cleared up.
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:43 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:
>
>> I guess the only difference is it isn't afforded the niceties of TCP or
>> UDP - in my experience it seems to be less fault tolerant when sending
>> larger packets. Also, I'm sorry I mis-spoke.  The maximum packet-size for
>> the body of an ICMP-Echo request is 65507 bytes.
>> I don't really have any documentation to back this up, but it has been my
>> personal experience that when you have weird cable/driver/card issues ICMP
>> with large packets usually breaks.
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>>
>>> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>>>
>>> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
>>> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all
>>> it
>>> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
>>> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with sustained
>>> data
>>> > transer.
>>> >
>>> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>>>
>>>         Lee
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>
>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> grlug mailing list
>> grlug at grlug.org
>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>
>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From bob.kline at gmail.com  Tue Jan 29 18:58:23 2013
From: bob.kline at gmail.com (Bob Kline)
Date: Tue, 29 Jan 2013 18:58:23 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] Newbie Network Quality Question
In-Reply-To: <CAJdZESqYqZdkbrVaT9avwVxrs8VE-n_7wrDNs4fjrSXFhWWXNA@mail.gmail.com>
References: <CAJdZESogNBqYe3VsBDtFYBAKvbnjxpF-w9z49EsrFzBpnKmDUg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAB73KvTdNpBajV8Fd4q5QgcW7GM_LBaGeKFSDLi7NfBZYOyy9Q@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESoc_opU6zmRWPceb19_x+fgaxAEF4Yb9EEF=o=1EQ3hng@mail.gmail.com>
 <CACbtCQ0Z4y8oNhXVtsSbvaXdxyaiVHMN1uu5JeUn4gdX+j+4ew@mail.gmail.com>
 <Pine.BSO.4.53.1301291636180.30651@Mail.omnitec.net>
 <CACbtCQ2Duj2F-VyHLzuDS5=TkZhF8YcrfiNUez2g29fGyDm6Hw@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESrb4s-hA0ixpRwJypd-4H=Wp1qxkvPUNMC2SNzFiZ9rVg@mail.gmail.com>
 <CAJdZESqYqZdkbrVaT9avwVxrs8VE-n_7wrDNs4fjrSXFhWWXNA@mail.gmail.com>
Message-ID: <CAFOq4EKsUwMcODAZTj9vdYuHGD=M9VSVz7tqBOh7tviLrEVFvA@mail.gmail.com>

So far, I've never had a hardware
issue when Internet access goes
down, and it usually just goes away.
You could flog yourself, and call
Comcast, but maybe best to just
do something else for a while, and
hope.  I test a few times each day.
Call it neurotic, or call it vigilance.
But I've done this long enough to
see that Comcast is mostly stable
in this area now, but is not more often
than one wants to believe...

   -- Bob




On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:

> Thanks for the suggestions
>
>
> Share and Enjoy
> Ben
>
>
> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:46 PM, Benjamin Flanders <flanderb at gmail.com>wrote:
>
>> Weird it must have been something with our internet provider.  It just
>> cleared up.
>>
>>
>> Share and Enjoy
>> Ben
>>
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:43 PM, Ben DeMott <ben.demott at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I guess the only difference is it isn't afforded the niceties of TCP or
>>> UDP - in my experience it seems to be less fault tolerant when sending
>>> larger packets. Also, I'm sorry I mis-spoke.  The maximum packet-size for
>>> the body of an ICMP-Echo request is 65507 bytes.
>>> I don't really have any documentation to back this up, but it has been
>>> my personal experience that when you have weird cable/driver/card issues
>>> ICMP with large packets usually breaks.
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Jan 29, 2013 at 5:36 PM, L. V. Lammert <lvl at omnitec.net> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Tue, 29 Jan 2013, Ben DeMott wrote:
>>>>
>>>> > Run a ping with larger packet sizes.  Ping's usually go fine even when
>>>> > there are damaged network cables.  One time drove myself nuts and all
>>>> it
>>>> > was was a bad 5e cable.  Ping with 4096 byte payload (maximum) would
>>>> > typically fail - and thats when I knew it was a problem with
>>>> sustained data
>>>> > transer.
>>>> >
>>>> Is there something wrong with speedtest.net??
>>>>
>>>>         Lee
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> grlug mailing list
>>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> grlug mailing list
>>> grlug at grlug.org
>>> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>>>
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> grlug mailing list
> grlug at grlug.org
> http://shinobu.grlug.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/grlug
>
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From casey at grlug.org  Wed Jan 30 11:41:27 2013
From: casey at grlug.org (Casey DuBois)
Date: Wed, 30 Jan 2013 11:41:27 -0500
Subject: [GRLUG] GRLUG/GRMakers Social TONIGHT Wednesday Jan 30th
Message-ID: <CAH4FDZGEZgyNa_zqhpxeor63ynFoqiynpS+DZ+4wQQDBf2vAiQ@mail.gmail.com>

Hello Everyone!!

I've received some great news about what we will be doing tonight and
wanted to share it.

We have a member bringing a Tesla Coil AND Quad Copter!!
We will also be playing with the MakerBot Replicator2 and final assembly of
the RepRap Open Source 3D printer.
The Linux router project needs some input from others as we've hit a snag
with our iptables so if you know anything we could use your help.
Also the photobooth is ready to be moved from 2 machines to 1 if we can
figure it out.



GRLUG/GRMakers Social Wednesday January 30th @ The Warehouse, 112 Baldwin
St., Jenison from 8-PM till whenever.
(Corner of River and Baldwin (south side) Look for the Sailor Man carving)
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/7337538118/in/photostream
>From Grand Rapids I-196W to exit 69C Baldwin St. exit, Left River (2nd
St.).
>From Holland I-196E to exit 69, Left on Chicago Dr., Right on Main St.,
Right on Baldwin, Right on River.
** Parking also available @ Ottawa Kent Insurance off Main St.**

If you are not registered for the GRMakers Google group yet please visit:
https://groups.google.com/forum/?fromgroups#!forum/grmakers<http://www.linkedin.com/redirect?url=https%3A%2F%2Fgroups%2Egoogle%2Ecom%2Fforum%2F%3Ffromgroups%23%21forum%2Fgrmakers&urlhash=dSX1&_t=mbox_mebc>


Here's some pictures from recent GRLUG/GRMakers Social's:
http://www.flickr.com/photos/caseydubois/sets/72157632599546408/

At this week's Social we will be working on fine tuning the Photobooth V2
along with finishing assembly of our RepRap Open Source 3D printer.
We will also be demonstrating the MakerBot Replicator 2 that arrived on
Friday.

I would like to ask your participation in the Fundraiser Dinner for Josh
before this week's social from 5-8PM @ Monelli's, please bring the entire
family!
* *
Monelli's Italian Grill will donate a portion of ALL FOOD purchases between
5PM and 8PM and this INCLUDES gift certificates or take out orders (tabs
must be closed by 8PM). Monelli's is located at 5675 Byron Center Avenue SW
in Wyoming (Byron Center and M6, by Metro Hospital)

Share the Facebook event page with your friends: *
http://www.facebook.com/events/493043854080257/*

Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org



-- 
Casey DuBois
616-808-6942
casey at grlug.org
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From don.ellis at gmail.com  Thu Jan 31 18:45:03 2013
From: don.ellis at gmail.com (Don Ellis)
Date: Thu, 31 Jan 2013 17:45:03 -0600
Subject: [GRLUG] Fwd: [PR] C++ Grandmaster Certification (www.cppgm.org)
In-Reply-To: <20130131153910.4964E544E6@minisox.tomazos.net>
References: <20130131153910.4964E544E6@minisox.tomazos.net>
Message-ID: <CALKyAevSi_NZ5bxJo+0CZPOWv2bhFrc4YCoKjBu_yr8hEhHN6Q@mail.gmail.com>

Just got this in the mail - thought you might like to hear about it if
you're into C++...

--Don Ellis


---------- Forwarded message ----------
From: Andrew Tomazos <andrew at tomazos.com>
Date: Thu, Jan 31, 2013 at 9:39 AM
Subject: [PR] C++ Grandmaster Certification (www.cppgm.org)
To: Don Ellis <don.ellis at gmail.com>


Dear Don Ellis,

Hope you are well.  We're helping put out the attached press
release today.  It would be appreciated if you could forward
or republish it in any relevant channels.

Thanks for your support.

Yours Sincerely,
Andrew Tomazos. <http://linkedin.com/in/tomazos>

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Subject: C++ Grandmaster Certification (www.cppgm.org)
Keywords: c++, c++11, linux, x86-64, compilers, mooc, course

1st Feb 2013 - San Francisco, CA - It was announced today by
the newly formed CPPGM Foundation (www.cppgm.org) that the
C++ Grandmaster Certification is now open for enrollment.

The C++ Grandmaster Certification is a massively open free
online course (MOOC) for expert C++ programmers.  It
provides the most rigorous C++-specific qualification
possible.

Participants in the course will demonstrate their
comprehensive knowledge of C++ by writing their own fully
functional ISO C++11 standard compliant C++ compiler, C++
standard library and toolchain - including a preprocessor,
assembler, and linker - targeting the Linux operating
system and x86-64 architecture.

The toolchain will be written entirely in standard C++.  No
third-party tools or libraries will be used.

As a grand finale the participant will build their
toolchain with itself (a self-hosting build) and pass the
conformance test with it.

Enrollments are open now and close 15th Feb, 2013.  The
course will commence shortly after in the spring.  For more
details and to enroll visit the course web site at:

    http://www.cppgm.org

For press information contact support at cppgm.org

ABOUT CPPGM:

The CPPGM Foundation was formed by a software company that
recognized the value to programmer productivity that a good
knowledge of language mechanics had to new developers to
their team.  The C++ Grandmaster Certification began
development as an internal training program, and the
foundation was founded to offer it publicly.

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