[GRLUG] Netflix on Linux?

Sat Oct 22 13:51:12 EDT 2011

This is what HDCP is all about. Your component needs to be able to
support HDCP in order to say, "hey, yeah, I comply with the
requirements that people not be able to do X, Y and Z with this
content, including requiring that the guy I pass this stuff off to is
also HDCP-compliant." This is done with cryptographic keys and the
like.

At each step, HDCP requires that a component support HDCP for it to be
allowed to receive and process data. HDCP compliance also likely
requires not allowing someone to scrape or shunt unprotected data. It
all ends at your display device, which also has HDCP support. (At
least, if it's an HDMI or DVI device manufactured in the last few
years)

None of this eliminates the analog hole, but it *is* designed to
prevent practical lossless duplication of the original. Even if you
could take the final 1080p bitmap each frame decoded to, you wouldn't
be able to re-encode that to a decent redistributable format without
losing picture quality to lossy compression.

So, for end-to-end support, you would need:

* An HDCP-compliant browser video playback plugin.
* An HDCP-complaint userland video layer the browser plugin can speak
to. (This would likely have to be via an X11 extension, likely
implemented by an HDCP-compliant X11 video driver)
* An HDCP-compliant kernel-mode video layer the userland video layer
can speak to. (This would likely be the kernel driver for the video
card)
* An HDCP-compliant video card (most (all?) NVidia and ATI/AMD video
cards already cover this)
* An HDCP-compliant monitor (trivial and cheap; I expect most or all
new monitors sold today are HDCP-compliant already)

*all* of the software components of this stack can be open-source;
what's relevant for the effectiveness of systems like this are the
cryptographic keys.

On Sat, Oct 22, 2011 at 12:08 PM, Mike Williams <knightperson at zuzax.com> wrote:
> Once the content is on a computer screen, there are plenty of ways to
> capture it regardless of video driver or operating system. If nothing else,
> you can point a video camera at the screen, and no drm shenanigans can stop
> that. I think the increased risk of content theft under Linux is perception
> rather than reality, but that doesn't change the situation much.
>
> ----- Reply message -----
> From: "megadave" <megadave at gmail.com>
> To: "Mailing List for LUG in greater Grand Rapids, MI area."
> <grlug at grlug.org>
> Subject: [GRLUG] Netflix on Linux?
> Date: Sat, Oct 22, 2011 2:23 am
>
>
> But the kernel is still non-proprietary. The 'closed source' app would
> still have to use the kernel to display the video, and this would
> leave a wide open way to hijack the streams and save them in perfect
> digital form.
>
> Now, if we can con them into not realizing that is possible, great.
> But I suspect they have tech advisors that are all too aware.
>
> On Sat, Oct 22, 2011 at 02:19, Mike Williams <knightperson at zuzax.com> wrote:
>> It's my understanding that this is exactly the issue. Still, it shouldn't
>> be
>> insurmountable. The solution would be closed-source, of course, but it
>> could
>> be done. Every so often I hear rumors that it's "almost ready", but I'll
>> believe it when I see it.
>>
>> On 10/21/2011 04:11 PM, megadave wrote:
>>>
>>> FWIW, I didnt even look at Netflix until I had acquired a Wii for my
>>> son and noticed there was a Wii Netflix app.
>>>
>>> I suspect the various studios and copyright holders will NEVER let go
>>> of the DRM that keeps Netflix from supporting anything
>>> non-proprietary.
>>>
>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 14:32, David Wise<davidn.wise at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I suppose that I could try grabbing more RAM and running a persistent
>>>> VM,
>>>> but that really eliminates the use of having a Linux machine in the
>>>> first
>>>> place. It is just several more layers of complexity that I need to keep
>>>> running when I could just use a Windows box and save myself some hassle.
>>>>
>>>> Bummer.
>>>> --
>>>> Dave
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 2:17 PM, Topher<topher at codeventure.net>  wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> On Fri, 21 Oct 2011, Steve Romanow wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Is netflix worth all this?
>>>>>
>>>>> Netflix has worked flawlessly in my XP/Virtualbox and now works
>>>>> flawlessly
>>>>> in my Win7/Virtualbox, even full screen seamless mode.  Since I need
>>>>> those
>>>>> machines anyway for testing and photoshop, it's a freebie for me, with
>>>>> no
>>>>> extra effort at all.
>>>>>
>>>>> At that point it's certainly worth it.
>>>>>
>>>>> topher
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 12:48 PM, David Wise<davidn.wise at gmail.com>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I am kind of hoping to avoid running a VM to get it though. I'm
>>>>>>> really
>>>>>>> wanting to be able to let my wife just fire it up and watch something
>>>>>>> while
>>>>>>> she knits and chats (like she currently does in Windows). Do any of
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> media players work at all (Boxee etc.)?
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Dave
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 12:46 PM, Rob Steenwyk<rsteenwyk at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Good idea, except the Android VM runs terribly slow on x86.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Oct 21, 2011 12:44 PM, "Michael Mol"<mikemol at gmail.com>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Oct 21, 2011 at 12:38 PM, David Wise<davidn.wise at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> That stinks. I've read something about ChromeOS having a plugin
>>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>>> supports Netflix, I was wondering if it's possible to use that
>>>>>>>>>> with
>>>>>>>>>> Chromium
>>>>>>>>>> or not. Again, I suspect I know the answer, but am hoping someone
>>>>>>>>>> will
>>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>>> able to prove me wrong.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Steve's reply just gave me an idea for a really hacky workaround
>>>>>>>>> that
>>>>>>>>> might actually work.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Grab the Android SDK, run Android in a VM, install and use the
>>>>>>>>> Netflix
>>>>>>>>> Android app.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> When you run Android in a VM in the SDK, you're running bona-fide
>>>>>>>>> Android. So, yeah, it might work. You might need to do some kind of
>>>>>>>>> workaround for 'device compatibility', especially if you want to
>>>>>>>>> fill
>>>>>>>>> a 720p or 1080p display...
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> :wq
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
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:wq

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